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Trump approves huge tarriff on Solar Panels

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    Trump approves huge tarriff on Solar Panels

    After two American Manufacturers of Solar Panels claimed that they could not compete against the influx of cheap imports from Asia, and one manufacturer going bankrupt, the Trump administration placed tarrifs on imprted solar panels of up to 30%

    This move, with high tarrifs now that reduce over time allows American Solar Panel manufacturers upgrade their processes to compete against the low labor costs of Asian Solar panels.

    With large tax incentives for Solar panel installations I think it is Fantastic that The Trump Administration is putting AMERICA first. If we are going to subsidize an industry through tax incentives at least the benefit of those tax incentives should go to Americans!

    KEVIN SANDERS
    4788 LISAS WAY
    SEWARD, ALASKA

    #2
    Originally posted by ksanders View Post
    After two American Manufacturers of Solar Panels claimed that they could not compete against the influx of cheap imports from Asia, and one manufacturer going bankrupt, the Trump administration placed tarrifs on imprted solar panels of up to 30%

    This move, with high tarrifs now that reduce over time allows American Solar Panel manufacturers upgrade their processes to compete against the low labor costs of Asian Solar panels.

    With large tax incentives for Solar panel installations I think it is Fantastic that The Trump Administration is putting AMERICA first. If we are going to subsidize an industry through tax incentives at least the benefit of those tax incentives should go to Americans!
    Yes the Germany and Chinese owned companies in the USA felt the off shore competition had an unfair labour advantage. The one company went bankrupt in September.
    Trump also put a 20% tariff on Samsung washing machines.
    These two moves should have an impact on the USA.
    Watching crow being slowly eaten in the PNW.
    The village idiot strikes again.

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by ksanders View Post
      After two American Manufacturers of Solar Panels claimed that they could not compete against the influx of cheap imports from Asia, and one manufacturer going bankrupt, the Trump administration placed tarrifs on imprted solar panels of up to 30%

      This move, with high tarrifs now that reduce over time allows American Solar Panel manufacturers upgrade their processes to compete against the low labor costs of Asian Solar panels.

      With large tax incentives for Solar panel installations I think it is Fantastic that The Trump Administration is putting AMERICA first. If we are going to subsidize an industry through tax incentives at least the benefit of those tax incentives should go to Americans!
      Ok so I still don't get it. The tariffs will raise the prices of this equipment. The exporting country is not paying the tariffs. American importers will pay the tariff. They will pass the cost on to American retails stores. The retail stores will pass it on to the American consumer who will at that time decide whether the cost is worth it or not. If they decide not, then the retailer is forced to cut costs, so lays off workers or closes. The importer due to slumping retails sales also has to lay off workers or closes. Those who do buy are paying more of their hard earned money that they can't spend elsewhere. How does this interference in the free market help again ? What happened to Adapting ?

      Comment


      #4
      Solar panels have been dumping into the US since 2005. Can anyone remember Solyndra?

      Score one for the USA. (and don't cry me a river about increased solar power costs)
      Custom CNC Design And Dash Panels

      iBoatNW

      1980 CHB Europa 42 Trawler- "Honey Badger"

      Comment


        #5
        Unfortunately, it,does drive consumer prices up. But would you rather support American business, or Chinese business? That is what is at the root of tariffs. Yes, people here are going to pay more, but they will be supporting American business. A big part of the problem we have had for the past 50 years in this country is that union workers wanted top shelf wages for their production, but then wanted to go to Walmart to buy everything at a discount. Union labor did not support their own industries. Result, manufacturers were forced to send their jobs to where labor cost was lower.
        1990 2755 - sold
        2005 275 current vessel

        Comment


          #6
          The only way solar is cost effective is with tax credits. Delete the tax credits and solar is just another gimmick.
          Mocoondo
          2002 Bayliner 195 Capri
          Mercruiser 5.0L V8 / Alpha I Gen II
          MMSI: 338091755

          Comment


            #7
            This is all about changing behaviours. Let me bore you with the situation in France. No Frenchman would ever buy a foreign import when a French product is available. It is in their nationalistic proud little hearts. In the UK and USA we go for the cheapest every time and wonder why we lose our jobs. It isn't really complicated. Buy foreign stuff and you will be better of for 5 minutes but when your job disappears don't whinge. Also, while I am whittering away: the long term effect is that we lose the skills to produce these things. It happened with software engineering, medical profession and everything else where we either export the jobs or import the workers. But, it is a choice and you make it.
            Terry (Retired Diving Instructor and Part Time IT Consultant)
            1998 Bayliner 2452. 5.7l V8 - Edelbrock 1409 4bbl - Alpha1Gen2 - Solent UK.
            MMSI 235061726

            Comment


              #8
              If the tarriff provides American manufacturers competition relief where they can mature renewable energy products then I'm all for that. As it stands now imo, the technology is not viable for the home consumer. Part of the equation is energy storage technology which needs more development.
              2003 Bayliner 245
              2007 Sedona F21

              Comment


                #9
                Just the mere threat of tariffs has shaken solar developers in recent months, with some hoarding panels and others stalling projects in anticipation of higher costs. The Solar Energy Industries Association has projected tens of thousands of job losses in a sector that employed 260,000.
                Watching crow being slowly eaten in the PNW.
                The village idiot strikes again.

                Comment


                  #10
                  Rick and Terry hit the nail on the head.

                  If we support our lifestyle through cost equalizing tarrifs on imported goods, to make up for low labor rates in some other countries, yes we will all pay a bit more for some things, including produce.

                  In paying those higher prices we will also be putting our neighbors to work. Those neighbors will then spend thier hard earned money on other neighbors goods and services, and the cycle will continue.

                  Now take the other side, the “free trade” side and run out the scenario. When a factory, or a farm is outsourced to a foreign country with lower labor rates yes you will pay less for that item, of course you will. Your neighbor will loose his job. He will look for work, but there won’t be much work available, and those jobs that are available won’t pay much, due to increased competition for the few jobs there are. He will go to the voting booth and he will vote for free insurance, and more services from the government because he cannot afford those things himself on his megar pay.

                  This is exactly what has happened and is continuing to happen in not only America, I suspect but in other countries that have enjoyed a higher lifestyle, and have adopted free trade practices.

                  People say that we need to compete in the free market, and in theory that is correct, in practice it does not work out. The reason is simple... No matter what your skill, no matter what your product, there is someone just as smart as you, and just as driven as you, that is willing to do your job cheaper, because he or she does not enjoy the lifestyle that you enjoy.

                  We think this is just unskilled workers, so we always say that our workers need to be retrained. That is just not the case. Take Technology as an example. I hold a Cisco CCNP (Cisco Certified Network Professional) certification, qualifying me to design, build, and maintain networks of unlimited size. If any of you reading this are network savy, you know just how difficult it is to build the skills necessary to obtain that certificaton. I did just that for a major oil company in Alaska, for years. I designed, built, and maintained a enterprise class network that controlled the flow of oil at the largest oil field in North America.

                  Just a month ago my old department was outsourced to a company out of India (Oceanic IT) who offers labor rates that no American company can match. Their employees are just as smart as us, and just as driven, and frankly just as good at their jobs as us, yet they are willing to work at a labor rate that is so far below the nominal labor rate for that profession as to result in no Americans wanting to obtain that advanced training.

                  Guys, look at developing countries. Look at their lifestyles, then look at your lifestyle. If you want to become like them, stay on the path of free trade, because in 30 years thats exactly where you will be.

                  KEVIN SANDERS
                  4788 LISAS WAY
                  SEWARD, ALASKA

                  Comment


                    #11
                    Originally posted by Iproff View Post
                    The Solar Energy Industries Association has projected tens of thousands of job losses in a sector that employed 260,000.
                    They're also a PAC (Political Action Committee) that has a vested interest in NON-US production. Not exactly a non-biased opinion.

                    I think the largest US producer of solar panel would disagree.

                    https://www.solarworld-usa.com/why-c...-manufacturing
                    Custom CNC Design And Dash Panels

                    iBoatNW

                    1980 CHB Europa 42 Trawler- "Honey Badger"

                    Comment


                      #12
                      I find the stock market's reaction to the new solar tariff interesting. First Solar (FSLR) is the largest american producer of solar panels and they also do large scale installations. The stock was up 10% in early trading in response to the news but has given it all back and is now even down slightly. Conversely, a chinese producer of solar panels, Daqo Energy (DQ), opened down sharply but has clawed back most of those losses.

                      Not sure what that all means. It could be that investors are concerned that since prices of solar installations are expected to increase because of this, there may be less business as solar becomes less competitive. In the case of DQ, they may be recovering because they will simply ship solar panels to other countries or it could be that investors don't expect the tariff to stick as it could ignite a trade war and then be walked back.

                      Overall, I think I am in favor of this tariff, but it will be interesting to see how it all plays out.
                      1998 3587 Bayliner, Port Orchard, WA

                      Comment


                        #13
                        Originally posted by baylineguy View Post
                        I find the stock market's reaction to the new solar tariff interesting. First Solar (FSLR) is the largest american producer of solar panels and they also do large scale installations. The stock was up 10% in early trading in response to the news but has given it all back and is now even down slightly. Conversely, a chinese producer of solar panels, Daqo Energy (DQ), opened down sharply but has clawed back most of those losses.

                        Not sure what that all means. It could be that investors are concerned that since prices of solar installations are expected to increase because of this, there may be less business as solar becomes less competitive. In the case of DQ, they may be recovering because they will simply ship solar panels to other countries or it could be that investors don't expect the tariff to stick as it could ignite a trade war and then be walked back.

                        Overall, I think I am in favor of this tariff, but it will be interesting to see how it all plays out.
                        80% of all solar products are imported. The majority of the 280,000 people employed in the industry are installers. The industry is planning on challenging the tariff at the World Trade Court.
                        Time will tell it's a good thing or a bad thing. It would make me think twice about adding solar if I was faced with a 30% increase. There are thousands of cottages on Georgian Bay that only have solar power. I would bet the same holds true for certain areas of the USA.
                        Watching crow being slowly eaten in the PNW.
                        The village idiot strikes again.

                        Comment


                          #14
                          Originally posted by ksanders View Post
                          Rick and Terry hit the nail on the head.

                          If we support our lifestyle through cost equalizing tarrifs on imported goods, to make up for low labor rates in some other countries, yes we will all pay a bit more for some things, including produce.

                          In paying those higher prices we will also be putting our neighbors to work. Those neighbors will then spend thier hard earned money on other neighbors goods and services, and the cycle will continue.

                          Now take the other side, the “free trade” side and run out the scenario. When a factory, or a farm is outsourced to a foreign country with lower labor rates yes you will pay less for that item, of course you will. Your neighbor will loose his job. He will look for work, but there won’t be much work available, and those jobs that are available won’t pay much, due to increased competition for the few jobs there are. He will go to the voting booth and he will vote for free insurance, and more services from the government because he cannot afford those things himself on his megar pay.

                          This is exactly what has happened and is continuing to happen in not only America, I suspect but in other countries that have enjoyed a higher lifestyle, and have adopted free trade practices.

                          People say that we need to compete in the free market, and in theory that is correct, in practice it does not work out. The reason is simple... No matter what your skill, no matter what your product, there is someone just as smart as you, and just as driven as you, that is willing to do your job cheaper, because he or she does not enjoy the lifestyle that you enjoy.

                          We think this is just unskilled workers, so we always say that our workers need to be retrained. That is just not the case. Take Technology as an example. I hold a Cisco CCNP (Cisco Certified Network Professional) certification, qualifying me to design, build, and maintain networks of unlimited size. If any of you reading this are network savy, you know just how difficult it is to build the skills necessary to obtain that certificaton. I did just that for a major oil company in Alaska, for years. I designed, built, and maintained a enterprise class network that controlled the flow of oil at the largest oil field in North America.

                          Just a month ago my old department was outsourced to a company out of India (Oceanic IT) who offers labor rates that no American company can match. Their employees are just as smart as us, and just as driven, and frankly just as good at their jobs as us, yet they are willing to work at a labor rate that is so far below the nominal labor rate for that profession as to result in no Americans wanting to obtain that advanced training.

                          Guys, look at developing countries. Look at their lifestyles, then look at your lifestyle. If you want to become like them, stay on the path of free trade, because in 30 years thats exactly where you will be.
                          So please explain to me why when it was Avacodo's we needed to "adapt" when it is technology or something else closer to home we need protection ?

                          Comment


                            #15
                            Originally posted by baylineguy View Post
                            I find the stock market's reaction to the new solar tariff interesting. First Solar (FSLR) is the largest american producer of solar panels and they also do large scale installations. The stock was up 10% in early trading in response to the news but has given it all back and is now even down slightly. Conversely, a chinese producer of solar panels, Daqo Energy (DQ), opened down sharply but has clawed back most of those losses.

                            Not sure what that all means. It could be that investors are concerned that since prices of solar installations are expected to increase because of this, there may be less business as solar becomes less competitive. In the case of DQ, they may be recovering because they will simply ship solar panels to other countries or it could be that investors don't expect the tariff to stick as it could ignite a trade war and then be walked back.

                            Overall, I think I am in favor of this tariff, but it will be interesting to see how it all plays out.
                            what about washing machines ? "For large residential washing machines, tariffs will start at up to 50 percent and phase out after three years."

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