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Where to buy best starter? Mercruiser 5.7

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    Where to buy best starter? Mercruiser 5.7

    Hi guys. My OEM starter finally gave up. Installed a DB electric starter 3 weeks ago, worked great that night installed. Went down to take the boat out today, starter is toast. I've seen Rick post about an all steel gear reduction starter, where do I buy one?
    1996 Bayliner 2452, 5.7, A1G2. Needs a lot of work!

    #2
    What is toast with it? Did the gears blow? If not a steel gear starter may suffer the same failure. Any signs of water dripping on it?
    1997 Maxum 2400 SCR 5.7LX Bravo II

    Mike

    Comment


      #3
      It worked great 3 weeks ago. Started and shut off 3 or 4 times, worked like a champ. I did shop vac the bilge out so it was pretty dry in there. Today it made some pretty bad grinding noise, motor did turn over a bit then would stop.
      1996 Bayliner 2452, 5.7, A1G2. Needs a lot of work!

      Comment


        #4
        DB sells BBQ Pork and Fried Rice starter motors. Most use a nylon planetary system ring gear.

        Look at the Square Block starter motors. These are Spur Gear reduction...... and use all steel reduction gears.
        Rick E. Gresham, Oregon
        2850 Bounty Sedan Flybridge model
        Twin 280 HP 5.7's w/ Closed Cooling
        Volvo Penta DuoProp Drives
        Kohler 4 CZ Gen Set

        Comment


          #5
          When you install the starter did you verify the bolts had threads exposed through the mounts prior to installing? Sometimes the bolts end up with the non threads portion exposed which doesn’t pull the starter tight and can result in either the bolts to break or damage to the starter. Rick has some great pictures explaining this.
          1997 Maxum 2400 SCR 5.7LX Bravo II

          Mike

          Comment


            #6
            It's on there tight, used the bolts supplied by DB , it worked great that night installed. The boat is in a covered slip with a bimini top over the back, bilge is dry. Rick, do you know a site I can buy a good starter or know a place locally ( I live 10 minutes from you)
            1996 Bayliner 2452, 5.7, A1G2. Needs a lot of work!

            Comment


              #7
              I’d like to know the details of the starter failure also. Like Mike asked, what exactly happened to the starter? What’s it doing? Clicking? Slow spinning? Grinding noise? Is the nose cone cracked or broken free? Could this be another issue like a faulty slave solenoid?
              FWIW Ive had really good performance from my DB starter motor even with its nylon gear set. I also thought my DB starter failed but turns out the one failure I did have was due to me cranking through a hydrolock, wasn’t the starters fault. Maybe look into that as a possible cause.
              Dave
              Edmonds, WA
              "THE FIX"
              '93 2556
              Carbureted 383 Vortec-Bravo II 2.0:1 18 1/4x19 P

              The rebuild of my 2556 https://www.baylinerownersclub.org/f...76?view=thread
              Misc. projects thread
              https://www.baylinerownersclub.org/f...56-gctid789773

              Comment


                #8
                Yep you read my mine Dave, I’d pull the spark plugs and see if there was water in the cyls.
                88 Four Winns 200 Horizon 4.3 OMC
                98 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0/Selectrac
                07 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 Hemi/Quadradrive II

                Long Island Sound Region

                Comment


                  #9
                  First off, none of us should be using a Non-Gear reduction starter motor today. We are way past that!

                  Secondly, try your best to avoid using a HTGR/PMGR starter motor that incorporates a nylon ring gear.... they will not last, trust me.

                  These will typically look like this one:




                  Here is a what the industry began calling the "Square Block" starter motor. These are now listed in the category of Mini-Starter motors.







                  These use all steel spur gears for the reduction.... no nylon gears, period!
                  They incorporate a solenoid/lever action pinion gear/sprag clutch arrangement.... no Bendix Drive action!

                  The mounting bolt pattern allows us to use this motor for either the 153 or 168 tooth SBC ring gear flywheel.

                  The armature (on any of the HTGR/PMGR motors) will spin approx 3 X's faster than that of a Non-Gear reduction motor.
                  This creates more torque against the flywheel and therefor faster cranking speeds, all while drawing fewer Amps.

                  You can find this motor in the Marine version.
                  I installed these (in the Power Master brand) on my own twin SBC engine boat. They have worked flawlessly ever since.

                  **************************************************

                  FYI.... upon good and trusted authority (who will remain nameless), there is no difference between the automotive starter motors (of this style) and the Marine starter motors.
                  They are built identically in every respect.
                  The only difference is the certification and the price that we pay for one.

                  Do what you want with that info.


                  .

                  Rick E. Gresham, Oregon
                  2850 Bounty Sedan Flybridge model
                  Twin 280 HP 5.7's w/ Closed Cooling
                  Volvo Penta DuoProp Drives
                  Kohler 4 CZ Gen Set

                  Comment


                    #10
                    More info

                    Click image for larger version

Name:	Starter motors  planetary vs spur gears 2.png
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                    Click image for larger version  Name:	htgr starter motor vs non reduction 2.jpg Views:	0 Size:	279.4 KB ID:	607911
                    Attached Files
                    Rick E. Gresham, Oregon
                    2850 Bounty Sedan Flybridge model
                    Twin 280 HP 5.7's w/ Closed Cooling
                    Volvo Penta DuoProp Drives
                    Kohler 4 CZ Gen Set

                    Comment


                      #11
                      I read through a lot of these ads before buying an ARCO since that is locally available but they do have the plastic internal gear. I recall coming across an ad for a Mando PMGR starter that had all metal gears but can't find it. I wonder though if that internal gear is made of metal, could it be pot metal that is not really necessarily stronger than nylon?
                      88 Four Winns 200 Horizon 4.3 OMC
                      98 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0/Selectrac
                      07 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 Hemi/Quadradrive II

                      Long Island Sound Region

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Personally I have 4 DB pm htgr starters in active service in vehicles including my boat, never a problem but I like me some pork fried rice. YMMV

                        Upon initial read from the op the first thought I had was in line with what Dave eluded to later, a semi hydro-lock is a real issue to check.

                        When I hydro-locked years ago it was while using a DB.starter and it survived.

                        (disclaimer)
                        i carry a spare starter onboard for an offshore insurance policy.
                        Haven't seen it since I stowed it 9 years ago.
                        I would have one onboard regardless of what type / brand is currently mounted to the block. But that's just me being me.


                        " WET EVER "
                        1989 2459 TROPHY OFFSHORE 5.8L COBRA / SX
                        mmsi 338108404
                        mmsi 338124956
                        "I started with nothing and still have most of it left"

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Dave was right. I had drained manifolds and power steering cooler, then trusting advice from someone that should know better. I pulled anode on heat exchanger and hooked shop vac up with a rag, drains back in manifolds and P/S cooler. It sucked water up the exhaust and into the motor, I thought it was sucking through intake side, pulled drain on P/S cooler and sucked rest of water out. New crate motor May of last year. Got the boat home this morning pulled manifolds and plugs, motor turned smooth by hand, water shot out and soaked my leg, half the cylinders had water in them. Sprayed a bunch of wd40 in the cylinders and kept rotating. Flywheel looked good. One of the big red wires broke off the starter and was laying in bilge. I think the horrible grinding noise was starter eating itself. Planning to order a new starter, install with new gaskets on manifolds and risers. Get it running then change the oil.
                          1996 Bayliner 2452, 5.7, A1G2. Needs a lot of work!

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Oh boy😳
                            Not really understanding how the shop vac pulled water into the cylinders, was she moored during that process? That might do it.
                            Regardless, with the discovery of water in the cylinders I’d suggest you get the engine running sooner than later to burn off any moisture in there.
                            Sorry to hear about this, not very Christmasy....
                            Dave
                            Edmonds, WA
                            "THE FIX"
                            '93 2556
                            Carbureted 383 Vortec-Bravo II 2.0:1 18 1/4x19 P

                            The rebuild of my 2556 https://www.baylinerownersclub.org/f...76?view=thread
                            Misc. projects thread
                            https://www.baylinerownersclub.org/f...56-gctid789773

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Check the oil for signs of water that may have gotten past the rings. This is why I was asking on the failure mode of the starter.
                              1997 Maxum 2400 SCR 5.7LX Bravo II

                              Mike

                              Comment

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