Trim Tab Fuse-gctid402001

[postie]

I had the boat on the water the other day and I was at the lower helm while someone was steering from the upper helm. Unfortunatly both of us were trying to use the trim tabs at the same time and they no longer work. I am hoping it is just a fuse but I have searched high and low for it with no luck. Does anyone know where it might be located?

[Guest]

I believe my trim tabs were added by the PO. My switches are at the helm and a heavy orange wire ran to the red selector switch. It was fused there. I have since added a positive bar for my pumps and things close to the selector switch. So in short, my fuse was not on a panel but 6" from the power source.

Greg

[Tabman]

If it is a Bennett system the fuse (20 Amp) will be on the power wire (usually orange) that is connected to the switch. 34 - 35 in the drawing. On a boat with two stations where will be a fuse for both switches.



Tom McGow

Bennett Marine

[postie]

They are Bennett's. I spent quite some time trying to trace the orange [red stripe] wire from the toggle switches but almost impossible as they ran into a large wrapped bundle of wires. I then tried to see if I could follow the wire in the engine compartment. Fortunately a previous owner had cut extra hatches in the cockpit floor in order to gain better access.[see photos]. The wire appeared to run into the cabin. I opened the electrical panel and found a fused red wire attached to the back side of the panel with a blown fuse. Somewhere along the run the wire had been spliced from orange to red! I now have working trim tabs. Thanks for the info on which wire to start with.

Attached files [img]/media/kunena/attachments/vb/706343=29976-2012-07-13_15-38-04_811.jpg[/img] [img]/media/kunena/attachments/vb/706343=29974-2012-07-13_15-38-14_173.jpg[/img] [img]/media/kunena/attachments/vb/706343=29975-2012-07-13_15-41-32_57.jpg[/img] [img]/media/kunena/attachments/vb/706343=29973-2012-07-13_15-41-37_645.jpg[/img]

[Tabman]

:coo-

Tom

Bennett Marine

[2850Bounty]

Tom, here's what I've observed over the years and with both Bennett and Boat Leveler.

(I think that we've had this conversation before.... so excuse my redundancy)

The power for both solenoid valves and pump motor, originate from the helm and at the helm switch (#'s 34 and 35).

The power supply to the helm switch is typically heavy enough for this. I don't see issues.

However, we're asking this rather light duty harness (#31) to carry both soleniod and pump pump power back to the pump unit.

This can be a rather long distance, depending on the hull size and distance from helm to engine bay.

Granted, loads are not extremely high, but the distance can be quite lengthy on some hulls.

In this little harness (#31), will usually be at least one harness connector (#32) that uses the small round pin connectors.

I see these become corroded, and cause loss of continuity.

The fix..... pull them apart, examine, spray with a corrosion blocker, put back together. This usually does the trick.

I've always wondered why Bennett or Boat Leveler did not incorporate relays at/near the pump unit, to take the load from the harness.

Have you seen this done before?

I do believe that the pump Negative should not come from the helm.

This can be more direct from a Negative source within the engine bay as per what the schematic implies.

As for operating both helm switches simultaneously;

I suppose that if one person was trimming the planes IN, and ther other person was triming the planes OUT, the solenoid vavles could care less, but the pump circuit may cause the fuse to blow.

Does this sound likely?

As usual, you're Johnny on the spot, Tom!

We all appreciate you being here!

Long live Bennett! :coo-

(I can't wait for this month's Bennett kick-back check. They've been a bit slow lately! )

.

[Tabman]

Hi Rick,

You are spot on with your observations and comments.

As you point out if the ground wire runs from the pump a short distance to the negative source the gauge of the wiring is almost always enough to carry the load. Since the batteries are usually aft in the engine compartment where the pump is also installed it is normally quite easy to set up the system up this way.

With some larger boat builders, relays are used to accommodate the longer wire runs involved, particularly on boats with two helm locations as the upper station can significantly increase the length of the wiring.

We do supply a relay for builders or owners with longer runs. The part number is RM12. Here is the schematic:



Systems that incorporate the Tab Position Indicators in the switch also utilize a relay in the system. The keypad operates on lower voltage (fused at 1.5 amps) and the relay back by the pump supplies the higher voltage (fused at 20 amps) to operate the motor and solenoids.

Here is the layout of that system:



We also use this type of system or RM12s with our SST and BXT systems (for boats up to about 120 feet) as the wire runs can be very long indeed.

The current "manual" Rocker Switches do have a mechanical lockout built into them to prevent pushing one Trim Tab up and the other one down at the same time. But if an upper and lower station were operated at the same time the fuse could blow. It's pretty rare for this to happen, but as we saw in the original post it can.

The RM12 mentioned above incorporates a circuit that we call an interrupter and prevents the fuse from blowing even if two switches were pushed at the same time and could be installed on a boat with upper and lower stations and would prevent what happened in the original post.

I hope this covers it, and I will get your check in the mail soon

Tom

Bennett Marine

[2850Bounty]

Tabman wrote:
Hi Rick, You are spot on with your observations and comments.

I hope this covers it, and I will get your check in the mail soon

Tom

Bennett Marine

Oh goodie! I'll be spending it on Bennett accesories anyway.

I actually need a second station Tab Position Indicator switch! Any issues with paralleling that you know of?

.

[Tabman]

2850Bounty wrote:
Oh goodie! I'll be spending it on Bennett accesories anyway.

I actually need a second station Tab Position Indicator switch! Any issues with paralleling that you know of?

.

Rick,

Do you already have an indicator switch at the other station? If so this is how it is set up:



If not, let me know.

Tom

Bennett Marine

[Guest]

This probably all happened because one guy was pressing the switches up and the other down since they were wired in the confusing "bow down" configuration. If you re-wire them to work straight, this won't happen any more.

[img]/media/kunena/attachments/vb/706642=29995-fishing_dock.jpg[/img]

[2850Bounty]

SwampNut wrote:
This probably all happened because one guy was pressing the switches up and the other down since they were wired in the confusing "bow down" configuration. If you re-wire them to work straight, this won't happen any more.

http://baylinerownersclub.org/media/....jpg[/img]

Dang it, Carlos...... I should have known that you'd mention that the switches are reveresed according to your world! :kiddingAs for changing the wiring to work the switches in the oposite tab function direction, and the issue not happening...... I belived that would be incorrect!The same scenario would have occured with one person trying to activate one mode, while the other person was trying to activate the other mode....... unless you meant to say that only one switch was wired "Carlos Style", of which would mean a new rule:Cabin = Bennett and industry standard configuration.Flybridge = Carlos configuration.Or visa-versa.Now they could do this without blowing the fuse!You know that I'm just fun'n with ya! .

[Guest]

The same scenario would have occured with one person trying to activate one mode

Except they wouldn't have been fighting each other since it would have been obvious which way to press the switches.

Excuse me, I'm going to the store for more bait.

[2850Bounty]

SwampNut wrote:
Except they wouldn't have been fighting each other since it would have been obvious which way to press the switches.

Excuse me, I'm going to the store for more bait.

Good one!

Carlos 1

Rick 0 .... but that is subject to change!

So if I'm understanding you, one person would have been more intelligent than the other?????

Can you tell me which one was which?

Carlos, did you ever start a poll on this?

It would be interesting to see how many people are OK with industry standard, -vs- how many would prefer to have the switch operation reversed.

.

[postie]

SwampNut wrote:
This probably all happened because one guy was pressing the switches up and the other down since they were wired in the confusing "bow down" configuration. If you re-wire them to work straight, this won't happen any more.

http://baylinerownersclub.org/media/....jpg[/img]

This won't happen again for two reasons. One I've learned what the results would be and Two When I ask someone to run the boat while I am checking something at the other helm I will let them run the boat and make any adjustments! Maybe something akin to micro-managing.

[2850Bounty]

postie wrote:
This won't happen again for two reasons. One I've learned what the results would be and Two When I ask someone to run the boat while I am checking something at the other helm I will let them run the boat and make any adjustments! Maybe something akin to micro-managing.

Postie, Carlos and I were just having some fun with each other here.

Carlos prefers to have his switches set up as to operate his planes as though the rocker switch position resembles the plane attitude, not bow down/bow up. He pushes the rear of the rocker switch, and his planes go down, not up.

I'm just giving him crap about his non-conventional wiring.

Secondly, you are correct. The likelihood of this happening to you again is very slim.

.