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1979 Bayliner 2350 NS-gctid397176

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    1979 Bayliner 2350 NS-gctid397176

    Hi all...I'm new here. I just bought a Bayliner and when I try to decipher the hull id it makes no sense to me. The hull number, embossed into the stern, is BLBA49SO878-9C. If I go to the Bayliner web page this number doesn't exist. On the dsah there is a placard that says 2350 NS.

    I can't seem to find anything with that number either. I know it's a volvo penta 280, and a sbc. I need to know the engine size...305 or 350?

    I can't find any stickers or id numbers on the engine. The outdrive has a number NR 2882150 B.

    I've spent a lot of hours looking on line for info, with a lot of dead ends, so any info would help. Summer is almost here in the pacific northwest (60 degrees outside today here on Sequim Bay) and I want to get on the water soon. Thanks in advance Murphy

    Attached files [img]/media/kunena/attachments/vb/700856=29396-DSCF0005.jpg[/img] [img]/media/kunena/attachments/vb/700856=29395-DSCF0021.jpg[/img]

    #2
    Welcome to the BOC. Send your HIN number to this contact and they will be able to help a great deal.

    [email protected]

    Boat looks like a Saratoga, placard may indicate Nisqually but not positive. I can tell you it was made in 08/78 but is a 1979 model year.

    The outdrive is a Volvo Penta 280sp. Most likely the engine is a 305 which is probably an AQ220. Read the sticker on the flame arrester and if it's the original it should state the engine size as well as some tuning information.

    Comment


      #3
      I'll bet that Wayne is correct on the engine displacement, although it's hard to say on the pre-1987 SBC.

      Find the casting number for the engine block, and search SBC engine block casting numbers.

      From seeing the choke plate helix in the intake manifold, it's likely an AQ225, of which is the 5.0L (305) engine w/ Q-jet.



      FYI: someone has split the exhaust manifold sea water supply as to feed both front and rear of the manifolds.

      If it works, I suppose that you could leave it.

      I'd certainly check the hoses and fittings, and install SS hose clamps.

      After you run the engine and warm it up, perhaps crack the man/riser bolts.

      After it cools, pull the risers to examine the sea water transfer ports.

      These typically become rust scale clogged, and will cause over-heating issues.

      Clean the rust scale, and install new gaskets.

      In looking at the heat exchanger supply hose, it requires the crankshaft sea water pump.

      Rather than refurbish the original, do a search for Johnson F5B-9.

      You can buy a new Johnson F5B-9 pump for around $150.



      Look in the BOC Vault for Volvo Penta AQ series related information.

      Post back to your thread here with any questions.

      As for the model, I'm going to say that it's a Nisqually.





      .
      Rick E. Gresham, Oregon
      2850 Bounty Sedan Flybridge model
      Twin 280 HP 5.7's w/ Closed Cooling
      Volvo Penta DuoProp Drives
      Kohler 4 CZ Gen Set

      Comment


        #4
        I don't know why I didn't think of it before, but I went back and looked at pictures of my Saratoga and would now say it is a Nisqually.

        Comment


          #5
          HI all...and Thanks for the info. I was trying to find any label or stickers on the engine, but it was repainted and any that where there are gone. The manifolds and risers where new and the boat was only run in fresh water about twice after that. The old ones where in the boat, and had seen a lot of salt water here in the pnw. The ones that are installed have receipts so I was inclined to believe the seller.

          I finally received a response from Bayliner today concerning the hull id. It basically said they had very poor record keeping back in the 70's, everything's deleted back that far,and the only two people that could have identified the hull id no longer worked at Bayliner, so sorry. I've looked at a bunch of Bayliner's and it is a Nisgually Flybridge. I think the -9C at the end of the hull id designates Command Bridge..or at least to one of the older-then me-timers up here says.

          Seems to me that the 305 and the 350's used the same flywheels and bell housing. How hard is an engine swap to update the engine, rather then just a rebuild? Something a little more efficient and reliable might be nice here on the Strait.

          Again..Thanks for the information. I'm sure I will have more questions as this summer is short, and a boat one the trailer isn't much fun.

          Comment


            #6
            Murphy wrote:
            HI all...and Thanks for the info. I was trying to find any label or stickers on the engine, but it was repainted and any that where there are gone. The manifolds and risers where new and the boat was only run in fresh water about twice after that. The old ones where in the boat, and had seen a lot of salt water here in the pnw. The ones that are installed have receipts so I was inclined to believe the seller.

            I finally received a response from Bayliner today concerning the hull id. It basically said they had very poor record keeping back in the 70's, everything's deleted back that far,and the only two people that could have identified the hull id no longer worked at Bayliner, so sorry. I've looked at a bunch of Bayliner's and it is a Nisgually Flybridge. I think the -9C at the end of the hull id designates Command Bridge..or at least to one of the older-then me-timers up here says.

            Seems to me that the 305 and the 350's used the same flywheels and bell housing. How hard is an engine swap to update the engine, rather then just a rebuild? Something a little more efficient and reliable might be nice here on the Strait.

            Again..Thanks for the information. I'm sure I will have more questions as this summer is short, and a boat one the trailer isn't much fun.
            Just finally got the casting numbers from the block...everything I can find indicates that it is a 350 cu in, produced between 1969 and 1976.

            Would that make sense as it's a 1979 year boat? It sure would make finding a replacement easy...

            Comment


              #7
              Murphy wrote:
              Just finally got the casting numbers from the block... everything I can find indicates that it is a 350 cu in, produced between 1969 and 1976.

              Would that make sense as it's a 1979 year boat? It sure would make finding a replacement easy...
              It's likely a replacement engine. The 23 foot Nisqually may have been OEM with the 5.0L.... not sure.

              Just what is it that you are wanting to do? Are you needing to replace this engine?

              .
              Rick E. Gresham, Oregon
              2850 Bounty Sedan Flybridge model
              Twin 280 HP 5.7's w/ Closed Cooling
              Volvo Penta DuoProp Drives
              Kohler 4 CZ Gen Set

              Comment


                #8
                Yes..I am needing to replace the engine. This boat was taken out of the water in running condition, pulled to the sellers home and then it sat for a year and a half. Now the engine refuses to turn over..froze up pretty firm. Tried a wrench on the crank etc. I have a 350 sitting here that was just rebuilt..only it is tbi. But..it is balanced, new heads, valves, double roller timing etc. If it's a small block in the boat, then it seems like a simple enough swap. And swapping is a little quicker then rebuilding. Summer is short on the Olympic Peninsula, and a boat on the trailer is not much fun.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Ummmm, seems like a simple swap, but not so much. Do some searching on here about marine engines, cams, carbs, distributors, etc.etc. vs automotive units. Powerbands in automotice built engines are all wrong for the power needs of a boat. This is not a huge boat, but in the late 70s they were heavy for their size. You certainly must not, under any circumsances use an automotive carb, distributor or alternator.

                  Others are much more knowledgable in the details of auto vs. marine engnes, but personally, I would not do it.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    The 350 I'm thinking of using has an rv grind cam in it. It was built up to use in a 4x4 truck to pull a large trailer. I would use the intake, carb, distributor, etc off of the engine that's in the boat now. From the checking I've done, it seems like it would be a good swap. And the marine parts should swap over. I just had a local marine mechanic over for some bar-b-qued steaks (beats taking it in for a quote) and he seems to feel the same as I do..with the rv cam and some parts swapping it should outlast me. I've been diagnosed with a terminal, untreatable lung disease and told I might have two to three years left. A boat that will be fun and last for two years is ok for me. Like all of us, expenses are a major concern, and being able to use what I have makes more sense then rebuilding a 40 some year old engine. I think a carb is more familiar to me then the tbi, so I would go that route. Besides..saves some extra wires!! I'll keep checking though, and I do appreciate all the info so far.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      The engine R&R itself is very easy on these. I'd pull the lag bolts, and keep the side engine mounts marked Stbd and Port. I'd also leave the flywheel cover (bell housing in the auto world) attached to the transom shield (separate the engine from the f/c).

                      Be certain to replace the PDS bearings/seals while the engine is out.

                      This means that the transmission will be removed..... and what better time to replace the drive shaft bellows?

                      You must use the 153 tooth flywheel. If your replacement engine is post-1987, then you'll need a different crankshaft flange 153 tooth flywheel (Camero car application).

                      Being that this is Closed System Cooling , you can use the auto engine head gaskets.

                      Unless this new engine uses a quench style piston, the C/R should be no more than 9:1 or so, or you may have trouble.

                      Stay with the OEM Ignition advance curve/limit.

                      The auto TBI requires a fuel return. To my knowledge, this is not legal in a Marine application.
                      Rick E. Gresham, Oregon
                      2850 Bounty Sedan Flybridge model
                      Twin 280 HP 5.7's w/ Closed Cooling
                      Volvo Penta DuoProp Drives
                      Kohler 4 CZ Gen Set

                      Comment


                        #12
                        2850Bounty wrote:


                        Being that this is Closed System Cooling , you can use the auto engine head gaskets.

                        Unless this new engine uses a quench style piston, the C/R should be no more than 9:1 or so, or you may have trouble.

                        Stay with the OEM Ignition advance curve/limit.

                        The auto TBI requires a fuel return. To my knowledge, this is not legal in a Marine application.
                        I've seen a couple of ads on line that say the boats have tbi on them. What would be the difference between a marine system and the auto/rv system? I've read so many posts and web links trying to figure the difference.

                        I can't remember which heads are on my rebuilt 350..or the compression ratio. I had them machined when I was down in Oregon, and I'm trying to find some paperwork that would remind me. Old brain symptom..forgetfulness. When I get a chance I'll look and see what their casting #'s are. I like the tbi, but again, I don't know enough about the marine issues.

                        Just a side note here..I have an other Bayliner..it's a Saratoga I think...25 feet. I got it as part of a "need a different trailer for my boat" deal and it's got a lot of good parts on it. The engine is gone, but it was a sbc, and it had a volvo outdrive. All the windows, gauges, I think some Morse controls, a bell housing and transom parts...lights and rails..a lot of good parts. If anyone local to the Sequim/Port Angeles area on the Olympic Peninsula needs anything, let me know and I'll see if it's still there. It's a good hull, but I have a landlord that's getting concerned that I am starting a collection of Bayliner's. I might even have a couple of good axles from an easyloader that are heavy duty. Let me know through the email here.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Murphy wrote:
                          I've seen a couple of ads on line that say the boats have tbi on them.

                          What would be the difference between a marine system and the auto/rv system?
                          Yes, TBI was/is quite common on Marine Engines....... but this is NOT an un-altered automotive TBI system.

                          This is TBI that has been modified to meet marine requirements, and Marine Engine load fuel metering.

                          Apples/Oranges.

                          .
                          Rick E. Gresham, Oregon
                          2850 Bounty Sedan Flybridge model
                          Twin 280 HP 5.7's w/ Closed Cooling
                          Volvo Penta DuoProp Drives
                          Kohler 4 CZ Gen Set

                          Comment


                            #14
                            2850Bounty wrote:
                            Yes, TBI was/is quite common on Marine Engines....... but this is NOT an un-altered automotive TBI system.

                            This is TBI that has been modified to meet marine requirements, and Marine Engine load fuel metering.

                            Apples/Oranges.

                            .
                            Rick..can you tell me what the difference in the tbi fuel systems are, or where to find that info. I've looked in the boc library but can't seem to nail it down.

                            I checked with the shop down in Oregon that machined my block for me, and they reground my cam. The fellow there checked his records (better then mine) and he said they gave me a "heavy Rv grind), and that it matches a marine grind almost exactly. I was using this truck in low range for skidding logs...Big logs, so it was built for low end torque, and pulling at 35-3600 rpms all day long. It has approximately 3000 miles on it since being built. I figure (I hope) that by changing over the intake from my existing engine, the marine starter, alt, distributor. etc, that I'll have a good engine.

                            Anything else I should check before I start dismantling vehicles and engines?

                            Thanks for the info too...

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Murphy wrote:
                              Rick..can you tell me what the difference in the tbi fuel systems are, or where to find that info. I've looked in the boc library but can't seem to nail it down.

                              I checked with the shop down in Oregon that machined my block for me, and they reground my cam. The fellow there checked his records (better then mine) and he said they gave me a "heavy Rv grind), and that it matches a marine grind almost exactly. I was using this truck in low range for skidding logs...Big logs, so it was built for low end torque, and pulling at 35-3600 rpms all day long. It has approximately 3000 miles on it since being built. I figure (I hope) that by changing over the intake from my existing engine, the marine starter, alt, distributor. etc, that I'll have a good engine.

                              Anything else I should check before I start dismantling vehicles and engines?

                              Thanks for the info too...
                              Murphy, I believe that the main differences would be fuel metering, the absense of the fuel return line, and that the Automotive TBI does not meet USCG regs in some way.

                              I do not know if you can even find an autthorized information source that would go into detail as to what would be the required modification, let alone provide documentation.

                              IMO, I'd not modify the TBI unless you knew precisely what's required to meet the regs, and then somehow provide documentation.

                              The issue of being installed within a closed engine bay influences what can be used.

                              I suppose in a Go-Fast-Rocker-Boat, with an open engine bay, our options are more open.

                              One BOC member has done this, but on an engine in a small boat. You can find his thread in the BOC "Completed Projects Section".

                              He appears to know what he's doing re; the feul metering, and can probably pull this off.

                              But things change for larger hulls such as your 23 foot SDN F/B boat......, IMO.

                              As for using the truck engine, the cam profile must be correct, and some will depend on whether or not you plan to close system cool it, or use raw water cooling.

                              Ignition timing will be considerably different the minute that this engine finds it's way into a boat.

                              If you follow a few guidelines, you can make it work with Marine carburetion and with a Marine ignition curve/limit.

                              .
                              Rick E. Gresham, Oregon
                              2850 Bounty Sedan Flybridge model
                              Twin 280 HP 5.7's w/ Closed Cooling
                              Volvo Penta DuoProp Drives
                              Kohler 4 CZ Gen Set

                              Comment

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