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Gimble ring sloppy again! Out of the box idea to fix-gctid778451

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    Gimble ring sloppy again! Out of the box idea to fix-gctid778451

    I have a 2000 Bayliner 2455 with a Bravo Three outdrive that we really love and use. We keep it in a berth 7 months of the year for the last 13 years, and on a trailer on our cement side yard the rest of the time. If I had known what I know now about B111s, I would have bought another boat for this type of use. This boat has a new 5.7 engine 2 years ago (cracked heads leading to failure), and lower drive unit (cracked backing into rocks) and gimble ring 8 years ago.

    We've learned a lot the hard way (money), I I try to do as much mechanical work myself as possible, oil, anodes, bottom paint,. We've used a certified Mercruiser repair place for all the heavy lifting. Now the steering has developed lots of play again, I can swing the outdrive 6 inches back and forth while my wife holds the steering wheel from turning. I've retorqued the u bolt nuts to 55 ft lbs each year when changing anodes. I can see there is play through the narrow slot at the top of the gimble ring between it and the tiller arm shaft.

    So this is a pisser! The crappy design and machine work on this square opening have failed again despite my efforts. So I know what the "proper" repair is, a $1000 ring, $85 shaft, and hell, may as well replace everything else too (again). B111 has corrosion damage, bell housing too, ram arms, etc. So $10,000 should cover it........................or. I can file, sand, epoxy and paint the corrosion on the outdrive as I have each year, I was doing this when I saw the gimble damage. I knew the steering was getting sloppy when driving the boat. And now the out of the box idea which I'm sure you will hate.

    How about drilling and tapping a hole between the two u-bolt nuts under the ss cover plate of course, 8 mm perhaps, and into the tiller shaft about 8 mm to pin the shaft to the gimble ring?

    I could insert a bolt with locktite, cut off the head, put the ss plate back on, reattach the u bolt nuts, and be done. No way it can back out. This should work, No?

    I;ve done similar things on old tractors, motorcycles, riding mowers, etc. Looking for feedback other than yes I will die for sure.

    #2
    50FT lbs torque is correct on that Ubolt.

    unfortunately, you will need a New gimbal ring, New SS upper SQ shaft, New seal.

    bad news is, it isn't cheap to do all this. good news is you only have a drive to deal with
    Joon, Kathy, Jaden & Tristan
    Uniflite 42 AC, DD 671N
    93 3058 sold
    92 2855 (day boat)
    91 Fourwinns 205 (lake boat)
    Longbranch WA
    Life is Good

    Comment


      #3
      Yeah, but what about my "fix"?

      They say insanity is doing the same thing over and over again each time expecting a different result.

      Comment


        #4
        The issue with the current design seems to be that once the gimbal ring begins to wear it gets to a point where no amount of tightening of the U bolt will work. Wear increases then at an increased speed. The gimbal ring is made from Cast Aluminium which is way too soft.

        I would not recommend your solution. There is a lot of torque on the casting at that point IMHO. If the casting should crack apart when under way you could be in a lot of trouble.

        As you have the boat out the water I would suggest talking to JRMarine. They can repair your existing gimbal ring and supply a SS steering pin. Hillmarine supply a SS gimbal ring that should last a long time but you need to do some research on that.

        As for corrosion I would suggest you check that your Mercathode system is working correctly.

        Sorry I can't enforce your fix other than doing it property.

        Cheers

        Comment


          #5
          well said Bboy!

          only way to jerry rig it is filling out the worn out gap with some sort of liquid cold weld then let it cure maybe

          might want to check the steering lever, sometimes it is just that worn out.

          Good condition used gimbal ring / transom assembly is cheap.
          Joon, Kathy, Jaden & Tristan
          Uniflite 42 AC, DD 671N
          93 3058 sold
          92 2855 (day boat)
          91 Fourwinns 205 (lake boat)
          Longbranch WA
          Life is Good

          Comment


            #6
            "bristolboy" post=778469 wrote:
            .As for corrosion I would suggest you check that your Mercathode system is working correctly.

            Sorry I can't enforce your fix other than doing it property.

            Cheers
            +1

            With your boat being moored most of the time you'll most definitely want the Mercathode functioning properly, sounds like it may not be.
            Dave
            Edmonds, WA
            "THE FIX"
            '93 2556 5.7 Bravo II 2.0:1 18 1/4x19 P
            (.030 over-Vortec top end-part closed cooled)
            The rebuild of my 2556 https://www.baylinerownersclub.org/f...76?view=thread
            Misc. projects thread
            https://www.baylinerownersclub.org/f...56-gctid789773

            Comment


              #7
              Update, it's not the gimble ring at all! After looking more closely with a strong light, the gimble ring is turning the tiller shaft with no play. I had never looked at the tiller or steering arm bolts since my mechanic replaced the first gimble ring, but I did today after removing the nylon plugs in the side holes he drilled and tapped. With the steering turned all the way to one side, I was able to get a 5/8 socket in there and it was way loose! I turned it perhaps 3 full turns before it stopped. Now my side to side steering play has gone from 5 1/2 inches to 1 1/2 inches, measured at the end of the cavitation plate. I can live with that.

              I was pretty sure my "fix" would be booed, and I'll bet it would have worked just fine, but we'll never know now. It's easy to spend others people's money isn't it. :P

              Comment


                #8
                Define cheap! Nothing about a Bravo Three is cheap or easy.

                I assume your cold weld comment is in jest.

                Flywheel to crankshaft connections in a big V8 get a huge amount of stress too, and a keyway and keeper pin (keyed joint) work fine. Just saying.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Yep! But different materials altogether! Plus centrifugal torque is not the same as levered torque....but I'm glad you resolved your problem without spending any money......

                  Comment


                    #10
                    "edheiser" post=778492 wrote:
                    Define cheap! Nothing about a Bravo Three is cheap or easy.

                    I assume your cold weld comment is in jest.

                    Flywheel to crankshaft connections in a big V8 get a huge amount of stress too, and a keyway and keeper pin (keyed joint) work fine. Just saying.
                    Not on any GM based engine I've worked on. The flywheel is bolted to crankshaft, 6 or 8 bolts depending on year of manufacture.
                    Dave
                    Edmonds, WA
                    "THE FIX"
                    '93 2556 5.7 Bravo II 2.0:1 18 1/4x19 P
                    (.030 over-Vortec top end-part closed cooled)
                    The rebuild of my 2556 https://www.baylinerownersclub.org/f...76?view=thread
                    Misc. projects thread
                    https://www.baylinerownersclub.org/f...56-gctid789773

                    Comment


                      #11
                      "builderdude" post=778500 wrote:
                      "edheiser" post=778492 wrote:
                      Define cheap! Nothing about a Bravo Three is cheap or easy.

                      I assume your cold weld comment is in jest.

                      Flywheel to crankshaft connections in a big V8 get a huge amount of stress too, and a keyway and keeper pin (keyed joint) work fine. Just saying.
                      Not on any GM based engine I've worked on. The flywheel is bolted to crankshaft, 6 or 8 bolts depending on year of manufacture.
                      Your'e right of course. I must be losing it. I was picturing the Honda Elsinore crankshaft I fixed for my brother in law

                      Comment


                        #12
                        In regards to the gimbal (and coupler), the drive should be removed and aligned after every season. A few hundred after each season will save you thousands over the long haul.
                        Phil, Vicky, Ashleigh & Sydney
                        1998 3055 Ciera
                        (yes, a 1998)
                        Previous boat: 1993 3055
                        Dream boat: 70' Azimut or Astondoa 72
                        Sea Doo XP
                        Sea Doo GTI SE
                        Life is short. Boats are cool.
                        The family that plays together stays together.
                        Vice Commodore: Bellevue Yacht Club

                        Comment


                          #13
                          "itsabowtime2" post=778597 wrote:
                          In regards to the gimbal (and coupler), the drive should be removed and aligned after every season. A few hundred after each season will save you thousands over the long haul.
                          AND... that would have caught that loose tiller bolt.

                          If you prescribe to the maintenance cycles and use them to stay ahead of the game, you'll be better off in the long run.
                          Custom CNC Design And Dash Panels

                          iBoatNW

                          1980 CHB Europa 42 Trawler- "Honey Badger"

                          Comment


                            #14
                            As to the alignment, it is a good plan to watch it as part of annual maintenance. The alignment tool is available for about one hundred dollars, at least that's what I paid for mine lots of years ago. Ed, you probably have the skills to pull and reinstall the drive although you may want to build a table with a slot to rest the drive on while its out. That puppy is heavy! Unless someone in my yacht club buys my "old" boat, I outta sell my alignment tool.
                            P/C Pete
                            Edmonds Yacht Club (Commodore 1993)
                            1988 3818 "GLAUBEN”
                            Hino EH700 175 Onan MDKD Genset
                            1980 Encounter Sunbridge "Misty Blue" (Sold)
                            MMSI 367770440
                            1972 Chevrolet Nova Frame off Resto-mod in the garage
                            Boating on the Salish Sea since 1948

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Thanks everyone for their input. It's not going back in the water until it gets warmer, probably April, so no way to test Mercathode system again until then. I'm 72, I'll be 73 by then, so I'm going to let Bethel Harbor pull the drive in the spring. That drive is heavy!. A man must know his limitations says Dirty Harry! I used to lay under a car with a transmission on my chest to install it, not anymore.

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