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Gelcoat over Flowcoat-gctid381419

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    Gelcoat over Flowcoat-gctid381419

    I just finished replacing my transom core and want to gelcoat the new fiberglass as well as the surrounding area. The problem is the surrounding has been flowcoated. I've read that if I sand the flowcoat, the wax styrene can get into the pores of the new fiberglass and make the gel coat bond poorly. How can I prep the flow coat without effecting the new fiberglass. Should I use plastic and tape to cover the new fiberglass while I sand the remaining area? Also, how much of the flowcoat needs to be removed. It seems as though the wax styrene was designed to float to the top so the flowcoat can harden. Does this mean just the surface needs to be sanded?

    Greg

    #2
    Ok so call me stupid but what is flow coat?
    1989 Avanti 3450 Sunbridge
    twin 454's
    MV Mar-Y-Sol
    1979 Bayliner Conquest 3150 hardtop ocean express.
    Twin chevy 350's inboard
    Ben- Jamin
    spokane Washington

    Comment


      #3
      Greg, I too am not familiar with flowcoat other than it being a process. Is this a bilge paint?

      Gel Coat is not suited for going over painted surfaces, but I suppose if you sanded it down, and washed it down with acetone, you may be OK for the limited areas that you'll be going over the top of.

      Call the supplier that you purchased your products from.

      As said earlier......., I'd still take the Gel Coat over paint any day.

      Much more durable, more resistant to chemicals, and easier to take care of as well.

      .
      Rick E. Gresham, Oregon
      2850 Bounty Sedan Flybridge model
      Twin 280 HP 5.7's w/ Closed Cooling
      Volvo Penta DuoProp Drives
      Kohler 4 CZ Gen Set

      Comment


        #4
        wefivehodges wrote:
        I just finished replacing my transom core and want to gelcoat the new fiberglass as well as the surrounding area. The problem is the surrounding has been flowcoated. I've read that if I sand the flowcoat, the wax styrene can get into the pores of the new fiberglass and make the gel coat bond poorly. How can I prep the flow coat without effecting the new fiberglass. Should I use plastic and tape to cover the new fiberglass while I sand the remaining area? Also, how much of the flowcoat needs to be removed. It seems as though the wax styrene was designed to float to the top so the flowcoat can harden. Does this mean just the surface needs to be sanded?

        Greg
        i belive that You talking about a waxed resin.You can use a wax remover and then sand it then put some bondo for the inperfections then waxed gel coat or un-waxed if you want to apply more coats.

        last coat should be waxed gel.Why don`t You just use pigment to flowcoat and paint it.it will be the same efect as gel

        "What is a flowcoat ?

        A flowcoat is similar to a gelcoat except that it is used after the laminate has been made. Flowcoat has a small quantity of wax added to enable the surface to dry "tack-free". It is usually brushed but can also be sprayed. Flowcoats, like gelcoats are available in a wide range of colours"

        Comment


          #5
          He is talking about the wax that should not have been in the final coat of resin.

          First wash the area with warm soapy water, then let it dry for 24 hours, then just prior to gelcoating wash the transom and blend in portion of the original gelcoat with acetone; be sure to wear rubber gloves, if you have a chemical resprerator use it, or at least goggles and a fan to blow the fumes away from you. The "flocoat" as you call it (finish coat) should be a little stiky, now you can spray the gelcoat on, I do not recomend a roller, you will not get enough gelcoat on it, a cheap electric sprayer or a cheap top loading sprayer works. If spraying thin a little with acetone, but no more than 10%, 5% should work. Harbor freight has inexpensive air type sprayers $10-$20.00. I use these and somtimes just throw them away rather than clean them up.

          If you decide to use a roller do not add wax untill the final coat of gelcoat, if you already bought the gelcoat with wax in it, spray it heavy with one coat, do dot be afraid to put too much on, you will be sanding almost 1/2 of it off to smooth it out, spraying will leave an orange peal surface.
          Pat says: DO-IT-RIGHT THE FIRST TIME!

          Bayliner 3870 "ALASKA33)
          Twin 350 GM power
          Located in Seward, AK
          Retired marine surveyor

          Comment


            #6
            I wouldn't use regular "pink" bondo for anything in a boat or even on a car for that matter anymore. I proved to myself long ago that bondo will draw in moisture which is why it peels eventually in so many instances. The stuff I use nowdays is the green fiberglass bondo. It's pretty similar to the pink stuff but tends not to be water absorbing and not much more expensive. Personally I prefer a nice rough sanded or even gouged surface for any of these glues / bondings or whatever to stick to including paint rather than relying on chemical "bonding or cross linking". That's real easy if it is inside and out of sight where you won't see it. Nice cross hatch with sandpaper say 60 or 80 grit if it's in the bilge or at the least knock the shine off of it where you are going to repair. In any case I would sand off the hull coat then rough it, gell coat it. Then later on after you are sure the gell has dried slap some more bilge coat on with a brush and you're goodern new..................

            Comment


              #7
              I have rolled and brushed Gel Coat in engine bays with no problems at all. I've never tried to achieve a hull like finish... it isn't necessary, IMO.

              If you plan on a second coat, omit the surface curring wax from the first coat.

              .
              Rick E. Gresham, Oregon
              2850 Bounty Sedan Flybridge model
              Twin 280 HP 5.7's w/ Closed Cooling
              Volvo Penta DuoProp Drives
              Kohler 4 CZ Gen Set

              Comment


                #8
                [QUOTE]driz wrote:
                I wouldn't use regular "pink" bondo for anything in a boat or even on a car for that matter anymore. I proved to myself long ago that bondo will draw in moisture which is why it peels eventually in so many instances. The stuff I use nowdays is the green fiberglass bondo. It's pretty similar to the pink stuff but tends not to be water absorbing and not much more expensive.

                You are right

                usually i use thicken resin to make a paste

                Comment


                  #9
                  If you want the best filler here is 3M's vinyl ester filler, it is the only filler that I use on boats, especially below the water line. it is more expensive than auto fillers, the green bondo will work though.

                  http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3...glGSZX2VBM8Rbl

                  I have in an emergency one time filled in a side through hull after backing it up with glass and resin, that was in 1994, in 1999 when I sold it it looked the same as the day I applied it, pink bondo, many years ago the filler was clay, no so now.
                  Pat says: DO-IT-RIGHT THE FIRST TIME!

                  Bayliner 3870 "ALASKA33)
                  Twin 350 GM power
                  Located in Seward, AK
                  Retired marine surveyor

                  Comment


                    #10
                    I learned about flowcoat on this forum. After searching the internet, I get mixed info about it. Some definitely say its a process. From what I gather its when you add styrene and wax to the gel coat which as was mentioned earlier is the same as buying gel coat with the wax in it. I will say this, don't count on information you get from marine stores. I've been finding that at least at the two marine stores I've been to that I know more about the products than the guys at the store. These guys swear to what they are saying is correct and from experience. For instance, yesterday I was in the marine store to buy my gel coat and I asked about the gel coat vs gel coat with wax. The sales person insisted that the gel coat without wax would fully cure without adding anything besides the MEKp. I know that isn't true from the hundreds of posts I've read from people actually using it. When I asked about the wax additive, he brought me to the polish and wax section and tried to explain about buffing it out. It really makes me appreciate this forum. I posted this question at 3am and as of 11 I had 1/2 a dozen responses. :-)

                    Greg

                    Comment


                      #11
                      2850Bounty wrote:
                      I have rolled and brushed Gel Coat in engine bays with no problems at all. I've never tried to achieve a hull like finish... it isn't necessary, IMO.

                      If you plan on a second coat, omit the surface curring wax from the first coat.

                      .
                      I've never used gel coat so didn't know if one coat would cover well enough. I ended up buying a gallon of gel coat without wax and hope that I can find the spray on PVA mold release agent. So the stuff will fully cure. Here are the steps I think I'm going to take:

                      1) Already washed with purple power

                      2) light sand to remove any surfax wax

                      3) vacuum

                      3) wipe with styrene or acetone to degrease

                      4) gel coat - no wax

                      5) gel coat and spray with PVA so it will cure.

                      If I should alter this schedule, let me know. :-)

                      Greg

                      Comment


                        #12
                        wefivehodges wrote:
                        I learned about flowcoat on this forum. After searching the internet, I get mixed info about it. Some definitely say its a process. From what I gather its when you add styrene and wax to the gel coat which as was mentioned earlier is the same as buying gel coat with the wax in it. I will say this, don't count on information you get from marine stores. I've been finding that at least at the two marine stores I've been to that I know more about the products than the guys at the store. These guys swear to what they are saying is correct and from experience. For instance, yesterday I was in the marine store to buy my gel coat and I asked about the gel coat vs gel coat with wax. The sales person insisted that the gel coat without wax would fully cure without adding anything besides the MEKp. I know that isn't true from the hundreds of posts I've read from people actually using it. When I asked about the wax additive, he brought me to the polish and wax section and tried to explain about buffing it out. It really makes me appreciate this forum. I posted this question at 3am and as of 11 I had 1/2 a dozen responses. :-)

                        Greg
                        that`s why there is a laminating resin and gel coat and there is a finishing resin (flowcoat) and finishing gel,but the cleark doesn`t know that

                        Comment


                          #13
                          wefivehodges wrote:
                          I've never used gel coat so didn't know if one coat would cover well enough. I ended up buying a gallon of gel coat without wax and hope that I can find the spray on PVA mold release agent. So the stuff will fully cure. Here are the steps I think I'm going to take:

                          1) Already washed with purple power

                          2) light sand to remove any surfax wax

                          3) vacuum

                          3) wipe with styrene or acetone to degrease

                          4) gel coat - no wax

                          5) gel coat and spray with PVA so it will cure.

                          If I should alter this schedule, let me know. :-)

                          Greg
                          If you spray in one heavy coat with wax is OK, if you need to spray 2 coats, no wax in the first coat, and add wax in on the final coat if spraying 2 coats, gelcoat will not cure without wax in the final coat, unless you spray PVA on it, the method I described first is less messy.

                          Either way will work. I think you are good to go, just put enough gelcoat on to sand, especially corners.
                          Pat says: DO-IT-RIGHT THE FIRST TIME!

                          Bayliner 3870 "ALASKA33)
                          Twin 350 GM power
                          Located in Seward, AK
                          Retired marine surveyor

                          Comment


                            #14
                            OK a stumbling block...

                            I removed the old depth sender and "bridge" that the bilge pump sits on. There was what looked like a common positive dc voltage block also mounted in the bilge. The bolts actually go through the hull. On the opposite side there is a zinc. I had always heard of this but didn't know my boat had one. Anyway, I destroyed the block on the inside which is fine as I was planning on either removing it or replacing it. Now that I know what it is, I will reuse the zinc and replace the block. Anyway to do that, I need to move my boat on the trailer as the zinc is right onto of the trailer rollers. First, should I relocate it so it doesn't contact the rollers every time it goes on the trailer. Second how would I move my boat back on the trailer far enough so I can do the work?

                            My boat is kept on a trailer not in the water so I don't think this is as critical for me as it would be for others. Of course I don't want it to leak but I'm not sure how much it does in my case.

                            Thanks,

                            Greg

                            Comment


                              #15
                              wefivehodges wrote:
                              OK a stumbling block...

                              I removed the old depth sender and "bridge" that the bilge pump sits on. There was what looked like a common positive dc voltage block also mounted in the bilge. The bolts actually go through the hull. On the opposite side there is a zinc. I had always heard of this but didn't know my boat had one. Anyway, I destroyed the block on the inside which is fine as I was planning on either removing it or replacing it. Now that I know what it is, I will reuse the zinc and replace the block. Anyway to do that, I need to move my boat on the trailer as the zinc is right onto of the trailer rollers. First, should I relocate it so it doesn't contact the rollers every time it goes on the trailer. Second how would I move my boat back on the trailer far enough so I can do the work?

                              My boat is kept on a trailer not in the water so I don't think this is as critical for me as it would be for others. Of course I don't want it to leak but I'm not sure how much it does in my case.

                              Thanks,

                              Greg
                              Re-locate it, that way you will not have to worry about it on the trailer.
                              Pat says: DO-IT-RIGHT THE FIRST TIME!

                              Bayliner 3870 "ALASKA33)
                              Twin 350 GM power
                              Located in Seward, AK
                              Retired marine surveyor

                              Comment

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