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    #1

    Sub Panel-gctid342345

    Thinking of installing a sub panel off of my shore power panel that is installed on the starboard side of my 2452. The dealer installed my shore power on the back side of the instrument cluster in the cabin. Most of my power needs are in the galley which is on the port side, a 25 foot wire run away. Rather than run multiple 25' runs I'm thinking of installing a sup panel in galley and making short runs to frig, microwave, and other upgrades.

    Need advice as to best way to do this or is not a good idea?
    Tags: None
    #2
    Should work just fine. Just remember to calculate the wire size based on the total distance x 2 for the distance, (there and back).

    Comment

      #3
      I assume you don't have a stove on the port side? Is there a panel above the countertop? If not, you could cut out a panel and insert a circuit breaker panel there. Lots of room behind that area to route wires.

      Onr of these two would allow expansion... About $150 each...





      This one has 120v going to it... Obviously too big but this is the idea...


      Doug ;}
      MMSI: 338068776
      "Go Aweigh to" Photos < click on red letters... 2001 Bayliner 2452 w/6.2 HO (paid for)


      sigpic

      Comment

        #4
        It'll work fine either way.

        When you run the feeder to the new panel, I'd use 1 wire size larger than required, and run it in some armored liquid tight conduit. You could also use AC3, an armored type of wire (Sometimes called BX based on old stuff), but it mostly is not waterproof, and usually is used for smaller wire sizes.

        The 'armor' is a spiral wound steel ribbon which protects the feed against mechanical damage, and the liquid tight is a rubber coating on the outside to prevent water ingress. Remember to get the proper clamps for the liquid tight, and clamp it frequently.

        Length of the wire (Voltage drop) will not be an issue for such a short run.

        The wire size is based on the ampacity chart in the National Electric Code (US) or Cdn Elec Code (Canada).

        In general:

        15A--#14

        20A--#12

        30A--#10

        etc.

        Chay

        Comment

          #5
          Go Aweigh2452 wrote:
          I assume you don't have a stove on the port side? Is there a panel above the countertop? If not, you could cut out a panel and insert a circuit breaker panel there. Lots of room behind that area to route wires.

          Onr of these two would allow expansion... About $150 each...
          Yes there is an alcohol two burner top but the admiral wants it gone. Of the four boats we've had we have never cooked inside always on the grill. No panel but that was where I was thinking of putting it like when they come equipped from Bayliner. Where do you find those panels West seems to be a lot higher?

          Comment

            #6
            cfoss wrote:
            It'll work fine either way.

            When you run the feeder to the new panel, I'd use 1 wire size larger than required, and run it in some armored liquid tight conduit. You could also use AC3, an armored type of wire (Sometimes called BX based on old stuff), but it mostly is not waterproof, and usually is used for smaller wire sizes.

            The 'armor' is a spiral wound steel ribbon which protects the feed against mechanical damage, and the liquid tight is a rubber coating on the outside to prevent water ingress. Remember to get the proper clamps for the liquid tight, and clamp it frequently.

            Length of the wire (Voltage drop) will not be an issue for such a short run.

            The wire size is based on the ampacity chart in the National Electric Code (US) or Cdn Elec Code (Canada).

            In general:

            15A--#14

            20A--#12

            30A--#10

            etc.

            Chay
            I would think I would want it water proof? And can the armor wire do 90 degree turns? Where is it available?

            Comment

              #7
              over40pirate wrote:
              Yes there is an alcohol two burner top but the admiral wants it gone. Of the four boats we've had we have never cooked inside always on the grill. No panel but that was where I was thinking of putting it like when they come equipped from Bayliner. Where do you find those panels West seems to be a lot higher?
              Yes WM is higher... I would not point you there... Try Jamestown Distributors https://"http://www.jamestowndistrib...portal/main.do They seem to have decent pricing...

              Maybe others can chime in on good pricing...

              This one looks nice... prewired too...

              https://"http://www.jamestowndistrib...+Breaker+Panel
              Doug ;}
              MMSI: 338068776
              "Go Aweigh to" Photos < click on red letters... 2001 Bayliner 2452 w/6.2 HO (paid for)


              sigpic

              Comment

                #8
                I'm in Canada, but I'm sure ABYC or USGC regs don't allow the use of "House Wiring" or BX and the like on boats. Even if they do, it's not a good idea.

                Get yourself some good 'Marine" rated cable. It's more flexible and has a tinned coating to help prevent corrosion. Since, most likely, your shore feed is not greater than 30A, a #10/3 boat cable would do for the feed from the existing panel, with #14/3 boat cable out to your devices. Blue Sea Systems makes many different styles and types of panels. I'm sure you can find what you need on any of the boating supply online stores or your local one.

                Comment

                  #9
                  I think waterproof (Liquid tight) is the way to go as well.

                  The cable itself is nothing special (NMD-90), then run it in the liquid tight. Even though it's armored, it will bend into multiple 90s no problem, but has a minimum bend radius. The larger the wire the larger the radius. You can also get 90 fittings for the end if needed, that sort of thing.

                  You can get the stuff a the local home depot, or the local electrical distributor, etc.

                  C

                  Comment

                    #10
                    I'll second the use of boat cable (tinned multi strand wire) vs. anything for Home Depot. remember I'm the guy who rages against spending more than you should for boat fixes. This is one place I never try to save money! Use tinned wire, use double crimp, marine connectors with the shrink factor and the hot glue sealant.

                    That is not to say you have to use the most expensive tinned wire.

                    Google Fisheries supply seattle and check their prices. I'm sure BOC has a group discount? If not the mods can request one and I'm sure they will concur.

                    Comment

                      #11
                      If you have lots of money, but the marine stuff.

                      If you don't, the other stuff will last longer than you will, especially inside the cabin.

                      Chay

                      Comment

                        #12
                        Just for clarification, we're talking about 2 different things here regarding 'marine' certified. The BX with solid core coper wire in it is not suitable for marine use. You can get the armour alone however and insert the proper marine 2-12 etc... wire into it and be 'marine certified'. A better solution is to use the AFC 'water proof' sheathing

                        [img]/media/kunena/attachments/vb/645186=23547-conduit.jpg[/img] (available at HD) and insert 'marine' cable in it. Water proof fittings are available for AFC conduits and are easy to use.

                        Comment

                          #13
                          Snowbird wrote:
                          I'm in Canada, but I'm sure ABYC or USGC regs don't allow the use of "House Wiring" or BX and the like on boats. Even if they do, it's not a good idea.
                          + 1

                          cfoss wrote:
                          If you have lots of money, but the marine stuff.
                          Buy the Marine wiring even if you are low on funds!

                          As long as you stay within the guidelines of distance and loads, installing and feeding a sub panel, and then branching out from a sub panel should not be a problem, IMO.

                          In order to install a sub panel, the primary panel must provide a protected and adequate size circuit to the sub panel.

                          By omitting several branch circuits in the primary panel, you should find space for a double pole breaker!

                          I'm thinking that the new sub panel should not require a main breaker..... just branch circuit breakers.

                          Are these loads actually warranting a sub panel?

                          .
                          Rick E. (aka RicardoMarine) Gresham, Oregon
                          2850 Bounty Sedan Flybridge model
                          Twin 280 HP 5.7's w/ Closed Cooling
                          Volvo Penta DuoProp Drives
                          Kohler 4 CZ Gen Set

                          Please, no PMs. Ask your questions on forum.

                          Comment

                            #14
                            cfoss wrote:
                            I think waterproof (Liquid tight) is the way to go as well.

                            The cable itself is nothing special (NMD-90), then run it in the liquid tight. Even though it's armored, it will bend into multiple 90s no problem, but has a minimum bend radius. The larger the wire the larger the radius. You can also get 90 fittings for the end if needed, that sort of thing.

                            You can get the stuff a the local home depot, or the local electrical distributor, etc.

                            C
                            NO! You should only use "Boat Cable" on boats 120V AC systems. No liquid tight, no Romex, no AC,BX, or MC household wiring. The ABYC rules are very clear, please follow the recommendations. BTW, I'm a commercial electrician with 30 years experience. I have added lots of extras on my boat and NEVER use non approved 120 volt wiring.

                            Comment

                              #15
                              All this talk about wire size and voltage drops is 100% irrelevant from a practical sense.

                              The OP has a 30 amp power feed from the dock.

                              He needs to have 30 amps of overcurrent protection and use 10 AWG wire that complies with marine UL and AYBC guidelines.

                              He does not need to use liquidtight or other conduit, namely because there is no way to terminate the conduit on either side of the cable run.

                              The way I would do this is to parallel off of the load side of his existing panels 30 amp breaker.

                              KEVIN SANDERS
                              4788 DOS PECES - SEWARD ALASKA - LA PAZ BCS MEXICO


                              Whats the weather like on the boat                               https://www.weatherlink.com/embeddab...59665f4e4/wide


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