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Snubber Before Or After Setting The Anchor?

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    Snubber Before Or After Setting The Anchor?

    My boat came with a snubber bridle in the form of a short length of chain with a wishbone-like shackle on either end, and two lengths of eyed rope.

    Seemed simple enough, so I used it last weekend. After dropping anchor I attached it to the chain outside the anchor roller and tied it off to the bow cleats. Then revved the engines to 1000 RPM and...one of the shackles blew up. The one the ropes attached to.

    I improvised a snubber using the remaining shackle, and that's how it remained all weekend, but did I do something wrong?
    "Mariposa"
    1989 3888 Motor Yacht
    Twin Ford 351 Engines, Sidepower Thrusters
    Rendova 11' Tender
    Richmond, BC

    #2
    On dads 44’ sailboat we always attached the silencer or snubber after backing down on the hook. Even after rigging the snubber the anchor chain (with a little slack) was locked down in case the snubber failed.
    Dave
    Edmonds, WA
    "THE FIX" '93 2556
    Carbureted 383 Vortec-Bravo II
    The Rebuild Of My 2556 https://www.baylinerownersclub.org/f...76?view=thread
    My Misc. Projects
    https://www.baylinerownersclub.org/f...56-gctid789773

    Comment


      #3
      Obviously you’ve noticed that the snubber system doesn’t have enough slack for setting the hook….and 1000 rpm is probably a bunch aggressive. That was meant to bring forth an eye rolling “no $*it”. With your previous boat it was probably on the edge of too much but with twice as many propellers that are a whole lot larger, it seems to me you are giving the system a serious load test.
      My anchoring evolution is to set the anchor (44 pound Bruce type) with both engines at idle (800 rpm) then install the bridal and pay out chain until it develops some stack from the pulpit. I’m sure others have different methods and I’m interested in hearing about them.
      Pete
      P/C Pete
      Edmonds Yacht Club (Commodore 1993)
      1988 3818 "GLAUBEN”
      Hino EH700 175 Onan MDKD Genset
      MMSI 367770440

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by Squidward View Post
        My boat came with a snubber bridle in the form of a short length of chain with a wishbone-like shackle on either end, and two lengths of eyed rope.

        Seemed simple enough, so I used it last weekend. After dropping anchor I attached it to the chain outside the anchor roller and tied it off to the bow cleats. Then revved the engines to 1000 RPM and...one of the shackles blew up. The one the ropes attached to.

        I improvised a snubber using the remaining shackle, and that's how it remained all weekend, but did I do something wrong?
        Hmmm! That is different different from how I use my bridle. I drop anchor and then tie the bridle and then pay out just a bit more of chain so there is slack chain between the bridle and the winlass. I DO NOT BACK OFF ON THE ENGINES. The purpose of the bridle is so that a sudden, jerky pull on the chain/anchor will not be transferred to the winlass and will be absorbed by the snubber. The snubber should not be use to put tension on the chain/anchor.
        If you are using snubbers on your dock ropes then drop anchor and reverse into a slip and use stern lines to the dock and employ snubbers on the stern lines. Then you should make sure that there is some slack on your stern lines so that if a sudden wave lifts or moves the boat the snubbers will absorb the tension, not the cleats and/or your lines.

        At least that is how I use them.

        Good luck.
        Retired, computer expert / executive
        Bayliner 285 Cruiser / Mercruiser QSD 4.2L 320 HP Diesel
        Live in the Bay Area, CA, USA, boat in Turkey
        D-Marin @ Turgutreis in Bodrum/Turkey
        [email protected]
        [email protected]

        Comment


          #5
          Squid, when you say your shackle "blew up" is it possible the pin wasn't screwed in securely? I now wire tie the shackles on our bridle to prevent this as we lost one as well once. We use a SeaDog chainplate secured with two Titan 2 ton shackles to 5/8" 3 strand with spliced stainless eyes. We drop the anchor (55# Rocna) and let out our scope and gently set the anchor. Then install the bridle and again back down gently max 1000 rpm to secure the anchor. Then we set the anchor alarm and take rangefinder readings to other anchored boats or shoreline. If after an hour all looks secure we consider ourselves "set" for the night.
          Forgot to add, after the bridle is installed we let out 2-4' of extra chain to overhang the chain plate then install a length of foam under the chain on the pulpit to prevent rattles overnight.

          James
          Last edited by MacPhid; 05-28-2022, 02:36 AM. Reason: Add process.
          1989 Bayliner 3888, 175 Hinos,
          Hurth 630's Onan 8kw MDKD
          Lowrance Electronics!
          Boating on Georgian Bay & the North Channel
          Completed the Great Loop 07/25/19
          AGLCA #8340
          MTOA# 7469

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Pcpete View Post
            Obviously you’ve noticed that the snubber system doesn’t have enough slack for setting the hook….and 1000 rpm is probably a bunch aggressive. That was meant to bring forth an eye rolling “no $*it”. With your previous boat it was probably on the edge of too much but with twice as many propellers that are a whole lot larger, it seems to me you are giving the system a serious load test.
            My anchoring evolution is to set the anchor (44 pound Bruce type) with both engines at idle (800 rpm) then install the bridal and pay out chain until it develops some stack from the pulpit. I’m sure others have different methods and I’m interested in hearing about them.
            Pete
            1000 RPM seemed conservative to me at the time, but I guess I didn't account for the added thrust this boat has. I'll be gentler with it next time.
            "Mariposa"
            1989 3888 Motor Yacht
            Twin Ford 351 Engines, Sidepower Thrusters
            Rendova 11' Tender
            Richmond, BC

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by MacPhid View Post
              Squid, when you say your shackle "blew up" is it possible the pin wasn't screwed in securely? I now wire tie the shackles on our bridle to prevent this as we lost one as well once. We use a SeaDog chainplate secured with two Titan 2 ton shackles to 5/8" 3 strand with spliced stainless eyes. We drop the anchor (55# Rocna) and let out our scope and gently set the anchor. Then install the bridle and again back down gently max 1000 rpm to secure the anchor. Then we set the anchor alarm and take rangefinder readings to other anchored boats or shoreline. If after an hour all looks secure we consider ourselves "set" for the night.
              Forgot to add, after the bridle is installed we let out 2-4' of extra chain to overhang the chain plate then install a length of foam under the chain on the pulpit to prevent rattles overnight.

              James
              The shackle had a keyed pin that is now bent, and the prongs of the shackle have been pulled apart in opposing directions. I'll take a picture later if I remember.
              "Mariposa"
              1989 3888 Motor Yacht
              Twin Ford 351 Engines, Sidepower Thrusters
              Rendova 11' Tender
              Richmond, BC

              Comment


                #8
                Probably time for a shackle upgrade! Any good shackle will have it's load rating stamped on it. I'm currently using Titan shackles, but note that they come in at least two ratings. I'm using the 2T shcackles for our snubber and for the Mantus swivel. The larger shackle that came with the Mantus swivel was stainless and one size larger, but only rated at 1.5T. The smaller galvanized Titan shackle is stronger and fit through the bow roller better.

                James
                1989 Bayliner 3888, 175 Hinos,
                Hurth 630's Onan 8kw MDKD
                Lowrance Electronics!
                Boating on Georgian Bay & the North Channel
                Completed the Great Loop 07/25/19
                AGLCA #8340
                MTOA# 7469

                Comment


                  #9
                  Suspect it was an unrated shackle that failed

                  I’ve always set anchor, then added the bridle - definitely easier approach if you ever have to reset. And I’m gentle while setting; know the anchor starts sitting on top, you want to take up slack, then drag anchor till it buries - then increase throttle to ensure anchor has set.
                  Jerking the anchor before it’s nicely buried has an increased chance of pulling it out.
                  1985 Bayliner 3270
                  110 Hino/Hurth 360A
                  previous = built own Roberts V495, circumnavigated
                  previous = Apollo 27
                  previous = Folkes 39, sailed to Hawaii
                  + few more before that..

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by Squidward View Post

                    1000 RPM seemed conservative to me at the time, but I guess I didn't account for the added thrust this boat has. I'll be gentler with it next time.
                    I'll be the contrary opinion here. If your anchor won't hold at 1000 (1/2 speed) RPM, its the wrong anchor or it hasn't set. Its best to find that out in daylight when the wind isn't blowing you against the beach.

                    To answer your original question, ,in practice it doesn't really make any difference whether you back down against the snubber or against the rode. Either way if you are truly set the chain will be straight out and rigid the way an iron bar is rigid. When I backed down on my Super Sarca the whole boat would shudder as the rode went tight. For convenience we would anchor, back down, do whatever else we did after arriving at a new anchorage and then some time later when it was convenient I would set the bridle. As someone else has already mentioned, I always dropped a long length of chain "inside" the bridle to act as a kellet to keep the rode low in the water.

                    Like everything else to do with anchoring there are many different opinions. Do what lets you sleep peacefully through the night.
                    R.J.(Bob) Evans
                    Buchanan, SK
                    Cierra 2755
                    Previously 43 Defever, Response LX
                    Various runabouts, canoes & kayaks

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Captains, I don't get it! I understand the need to reverse, at whatever speed you seem right, (1000rpm or other) to make sure that the anchor has set in! What I don't get is why you do so AFTER you have tied the bridle. I always first set the anchor and then, if I am satisfied with it, I tie the snubber/bridle whose only function (as far as I am concerned) is to prevent a sudden, jerking force to be received by the winlass.

                      Any way. safe boating.
                      Retired, computer expert / executive
                      Bayliner 285 Cruiser / Mercruiser QSD 4.2L 320 HP Diesel
                      Live in the Bay Area, CA, USA, boat in Turkey
                      D-Marin @ Turgutreis in Bodrum/Turkey
                      [email protected]
                      [email protected]

                      Comment


                      • builderdude
                        builderdude commented
                        Editing a comment
                        My thought as well👍🏼

                      #12
                      We're new but so far we have been setting the anchor prior to rigging up the bridle. As others have said, it would be really inconvenient to have to start over if the anchor didn't hold and the bridle was already rigged. We run the bridle to both bow cleats, and drop the chain so that a bit hangs below the back of the bridle hook. Seems to keep the hook from popping out.
                      Brad
                      Lake Union, Seattle
                      1987 Bayliner 4550 "Ark Angel"
                      Hino EH700T / MG-502 / Cummins Onan 7kw
                      Seattle Yacht Club

                      Comment


                        #13
                        When backing down on the anchor to ensure it's set, I prefer not to have that load on the pulpit and windlass directly. Plus I want to know that the snubber/bridle will hold the load as that is our final configuration for the night.

                        James
                        1989 Bayliner 3888, 175 Hinos,
                        Hurth 630's Onan 8kw MDKD
                        Lowrance Electronics!
                        Boating on Georgian Bay & the North Channel
                        Completed the Great Loop 07/25/19
                        AGLCA #8340
                        MTOA# 7469

                        Comment


                          #14
                          Originally posted by MacPhid View Post
                          When backing down on the anchor to ensure it's set, I prefer not to have that load on the pulpit and windlass directly. Plus I want to know that the snubber/bridle will hold the load as that is our final configuration for the night.

                          James
                          I don't want to keep beating a dead horse, especially when the jury is still out about its health! Yet, it seems to me that to undo the bridle/snubber because the anchor had not set in properly and I may need to pick up and re deploy the anchor is reason enough to tie the bridle/snubber only AFTER I am satisfied with how/where I have dropped anchor. Indeed, sometimes I wait for 5 - 10 minutes before I am satisfied with everything before I deploy the bridle. Still, every captain has his/her own way.

                          Be safe!
                          Retired, computer expert / executive
                          Bayliner 285 Cruiser / Mercruiser QSD 4.2L 320 HP Diesel
                          Live in the Bay Area, CA, USA, boat in Turkey
                          D-Marin @ Turgutreis in Bodrum/Turkey
                          [email protected]
                          [email protected]

                          Comment


                            #15
                            Some threads make it painfully obvious that most people don't actually anchor all that often.
                            R.J.(Bob) Evans
                            Buchanan, SK
                            Cierra 2755
                            Previously 43 Defever, Response LX
                            Various runabouts, canoes & kayaks

                            Comment

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