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Hino Alternator External Regulation Conversion

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    #16
    Picture of 2800 series, 160 amp Leece Neville's can be converted to external regulation easily as regulator is screwed to back of alternator (this one has data plate sticker on regulator ).

    All that's required is to bring 2 field leads out from regulator.Leads shown are powering regulator. Picture of typical J180, 6 diode 120-180 amp alternator.
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    Picture of 4800 series J180, 200 - 320 amp 12 diode alternator. 4800 series have combo brush holder and regulator regulator screwed onto top above rear terminals, to convert to external regulation remove 4 screws, pull regulator and replace with simple plate with 2 studs with terminals, 10 minute job. Note how extra diode pack is attached to back of alternator.
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    There are lots of variations of these LARGE CASE alternators... you will know one when you see one. Prestolite lists every alternator LN has made has lots of information including drawings and output graphs. But there web site is not user friendly. So lots of manual hunting.
    Don't rule out clones, It depends on build quality. There are quality clones built for ambulances, tow trucks or other high demand applications.
    Hino's have small J180 foot about 3 1/4 inches long.Most of these LN alternators have large J180 foot at 4 inches. Longer lower bolt and 3/16" shiming washers needed to line up pulleys.
    Don't over speed large case alternators... 6000 RPM is about it. Small case alternators can take 10,000 - 12,000 RPM.
    With Hino's the stock pulleys provide 2 to 1 ratio which is perfect. If converting gas engine your going to need under drive pulleys.
    Rod
    1991 4387
    Sidney, BC

    Comment


      #17
      Rody,

      thanks for the info. I greatly appreciate it.
      Ships n Giggles
      1993 Bayliner 4388
      MMSI# 367412710
      Day Island Yacht Club
      Commodore

      Comment


        #18
        Here are pictures of mock up of 4800 series on W06. Note the shims between J180 small foot and large foot on alternator. Only modification needed is upper belt tension arm to be brought forward 1 inch. Will make new arm to provide clearance for coolant hose. New arm will be in front alternator.
        This alternator is single wire, and does not need any part of Nippon Denso wiring. Have external 3 stage regulator that will be installed to complete winter project.
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        Rod
        1991 4387
        Sidney, BC

        Comment


          #19
          Looks awesome Roddy, great job man. Those look beautiful. I'll be getting on this shortly. I have to get a couple of other projects done on the boat. But at least I am going into the off season not worrying how much time I have to spend fixing everything before the spring. Right now most of my projects are either cosmetic or upgrades, most everything else is done.
          Ships n Giggles
          1993 Bayliner 4388
          MMSI# 367412710
          Day Island Yacht Club
          Commodore

          Comment


            #20
            Same with me... running Denso's until have time to complete over winter.
            Installing Leece Neville on port engine as there is lots room and perfect sight lines. Starboard only has about a foot between fuel tank and alternator.
            Electrically it looks straight forward to move starboard Denso alternator connections on Master Battery Panel, switches from house assignment to engine.
            Need to use a lot of 3/0 $$$. Will use garden hose to mock up alternator output and ground routing. Then get cables made up.
            ABYC requires 2 fuses, one at alternator and other at battery. Will use the new negative color option, yellow.
            Rod
            1991 4387
            Sidney, BC

            Comment


              #21
              Roddy, I picked up some 2/0 wire 25ft off of Amazon for $50 which is really reasonable. I didn't bother using tinned wire because I dip the ends in dielectric grease anyways which protects the copper and makes the use of tinned wire not necessary in most cases. I use tinned wire in AC circuits and my communication lines.
              Ships n Giggles
              1993 Bayliner 4388
              MMSI# 367412710
              Day Island Yacht Club
              Commodore

              Comment


                #22
                Question, why do you need 3/0 wire?? 2AWG wire will handle 160Amps for the 10 feet that we need, and I'd never run the alternators at that high anyways... I'd run them at 70% max for longevity and not boiling the batteries to death by pushing too much current to them.
                Ships n Giggles
                1993 Bayliner 4388
                MMSI# 367412710
                Day Island Yacht Club
                Commodore

                Comment


                  #23
                  The strand count is, to me, the bigger factor between 2/0 and 3/0. If the strand count is really high in the 2/0, it may very well carry the power better than a low count 3/0. Just what you need, one more variable to consider.
                  P/C Pete
                  Edmonds Yacht Club (Commodore 1993)
                  1988 3818 "GLAUBEN”
                  Hino EH700 175 Onan MDKD Genset
                  MMSI 367770440

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Agree 2/0 is ok for our use. Normal cruise is 6 knots SOG at 1100 rpm. Translates into approximately 2200 alternator rpm.
                    Looking at output graph its about 150 amps. 2/0 is fine 99% of the time...
                    Alternator at 2500 engine rpm = 5000 alternator rpm. 5000 rpm = 225 amps. So to be 100% with ABYC I need 3/0.
                    Blue Seas Circiit Wizzard free app, has handy calculator for volts amps and length.
                    Thats how I know 3/0 is required.
                    Going to run 3/0 ground as well. Dont like the long path grounding conductors take. Cant trace them easily, but think they probably terminate at starting battery and have tie with house negitive.
                    Due to battery location its an 18 foot run (10 feet on positive and 8 feet on negative). Will use 2 X 250 amp ANL fuses, they have 15% overload for 10 minutes. I'm sure by 10 minutes at full load alternator will be hot and output drops low enough so that fuse will not blow.


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                    Rod
                    1991 4387
                    Sidney, BC

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Are you planning on using an external regulator? If so you can just limit the amperage through the regulator. I also believe that the units you are getting have built in Amp load adjustment screw. Either way, you will end up about the same spot if you take the money you would spend on 3/0 wire and get external monitors from Balmar. Just a thought.
                      Ships n Giggles
                      1993 Bayliner 4388
                      MMSI# 367412710
                      Day Island Yacht Club
                      Commodore

                      Comment


                        #26
                        Yes, using marine rated tinned 3/0 is pricey! This is why I'm mocking cables up using 5/8's hose.
                        Talked to marine electrician, he says circuit has to be cabled for maximum alternator output for safety. If insurance surveyor was to look, it has meet ABYC, so no welding cable,
                        Rod
                        1991 4387
                        Sidney, BC

                        Comment


                          #27
                          Ummm... I don't know about that... Seriously I don't. I talked to my insurance company extensively before doing the LiFePO4 battery upgrades, and have spoken to a marine surveyor that specializes in insurance surveys... they all said that regular wire is fine so long as it is properly protected, ie. dielectric grease put on it before crimping the connectors and I actually went the extra mile and heat shrunk the wire and the connector to prevent moisture of getting in there. If I am soldering the wire together, I'll use the tinned wire just because it is really easy to solder, but other than that I've always gone with standard copper. I am all about safety but copper wiring has been used in boats for decades without serious problems. Either way, good luck to you man. It is going to be a bear of a project. 3/0 tinned wire is a bear to handle... I don't envy you one bit.
                          Ships n Giggles
                          1993 Bayliner 4388
                          MMSI# 367412710
                          Day Island Yacht Club
                          Commodore

                          Comment


                            #28
                            Correct, marine wire doesn't have to be tinned or even marine grade. ABYC regulations are for guidance only. Unlike National Electrical Code that is the law. Even under NEC you will not find many electrical engineers or electricians that just meet NEC codes, most exceed the minimums.
                            Problems begin when something goes wrong and insurance claim is made. I don't want to spend $13 bucks a foot for Marine cable either. But playing with 150 plus amps, if something goes wrong, its gets really bad, really fast! Fuel lines, filters, high amperage cables and high amperage fuses in the same basket, both are safety items.
                            Forgot to add that having 200 amp alternator opens the door for fast charging LiFePO4 batteries that can take everything alternator can produce.
                            Rod
                            1991 4387
                            Sidney, BC

                            Comment


                              #29
                              Yeah, I know... kinda crazy how expensive things get. Are you going to be doing LiFePO4 batteries?
                              Ships n Giggles
                              1993 Bayliner 4388
                              MMSI# 367412710
                              Day Island Yacht Club
                              Commodore

                              Comment


                                #30
                                Not yet... 8 new flooded batteries last fall and new starting 8D in August. Next set will be LP04 for house.
                                Rod
                                1991 4387
                                Sidney, BC

                                Comment

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