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Lightsquared denied permission for nationwide wifi-gctid354343

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    Lightsquared denied permission for nationwide wifi-gctid354343

    Due to poor engineering processes of GPS manufacturers Lightsquared has been denied permission to use spectrum near GPS.

    It seems the GPS receivers do not properly filter the signals they receive and are sensitive to transmissions outside of their spectrum. I dont know of any other case like this where poor engineering = spectrum grab.

    Like I said in another thread - GPS votes, dont worry about it.

    http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/n...red-failed.ars

    #2
    Yup, sad loss to the consumer and sad that screwing up your own FCC compliance leads to someone else losing their ability to use the spectrum they own.

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      #3
      Lightsquared also admittedly had problems with signal stability and harmonics. Keeping their higher powered signals out of the GPS spectrum was also part of the decision. The Inmarsat system has been doomed for a long time though and the Iridium network is another example of another failed attempt to breath life into those bands commercially.

      They can't force GPS manufacturers to improve their filtering... and they can't legitimately stay cleanly within their spectrum (albeit not totally their fault) so they're toast. They'll be in bankruptcy proceedings soon.
      Custom CNC Design And Dash Panels

      iBoatNW

      1980 CHB Europa 42 Trawler- "Honey Badger"

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        #4
        Very likely a case of Money and Politics trumping science and engineering. Hard to know, but it seemed like it could have worked...

        Comment


          #5
          It was risky from the get go and Light Squared assumed (wrongly) that the GPS manufacturers would step up to the higher level of filtering and signal rejection necessary to keep the harmonics and bleed-over from being a problem. They didn't and decided to lobby against Light Squared instead. They won.
          Custom CNC Design And Dash Panels

          iBoatNW

          1980 CHB Europa 42 Trawler- "Honey Badger"

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            #6
            But isn't Light Squared really misusing the spectrum? They're trying to push a high-power signal on a spectrum that's allocated for low power.

            And all the signals that are using adjacent low-power spectrums expected similar low-power signals.

            Its similar to Light Squared pushing too much current down a wire, creating excess heat and melting adjacent wiring.

            And then blaming the adjacent wiring for it inability to handle extreme conditions beyond the original set of requirements.

            In a nutshell, they brought this on themselves..
            Pat
            Paragon
            1999 4788

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              #7
              In a way they did. But they were really banking on the others to see it coming and step up. They did not. It was a business risk and they arne gonna lose I'd suspect.
              Custom CNC Design And Dash Panels

              iBoatNW

              1980 CHB Europa 42 Trawler- "Honey Badger"

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                #8
                GOOD!!!:hammer

                Vic

                Fort Myers
                Vic Stewart SN
                Past Commander
                Cape Fear Power Squadron
                Ft Myers Power Squadron
                1998 2859 7.4 L/B2
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                  #9
                  They didn't and decided to lobby against Light Squared instead. They won.
                  Well, and the cell industry dumped a bunch of money in that direction too. That was their real enemy. Lightsquared would have been great for consumers, so the cell carriers sure didn't want it around.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Tpautler wrote:
                    Very likely a case of Money and Politics trumping science and engineering. Hard to know, but it seemed like it could have worked...
                    I think it was more the other way around. Money and politics were willing to push this technology through in spite of the science demonstrating interference with existing engineering, and the rest of us were supposed to adapt with newer units. All for the sake of the government mandating cell and broadband coverage for all.
                    Simo
                    2002 2855 350MPI Bravo III on Lake Champlain -> SOLD!
                    Downsized to a couple of kayaks for now.

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                      #11
                      cosmo777 wrote:
                      But isn't Light Squared really misusing the spectrum? They're trying to push a high-power signal on a spectrum that's allocated for low power.

                      And all the signals that are using adjacent low-power spectrums expected similar low-power signals.

                      Its similar to Light Squared pushing too much current down a wire, creating excess heat and melting adjacent wiring.

                      And then blaming the adjacent wiring for it inability to handle extreme conditions beyond the original set of requirements.

                      In a nutshell, they brought this on themselves..
                      Actually, the FCC put these guys (GPS industry) on notice 10 years ago about assigning adjacent spectrum. They ignored it and then cried foul when someone actually bought it and tried to use it. Sorry, Lightsquared is not the bad guy here, at least not as far as I can tell. They played by the rules and were then played by the FCC. I expect the FCC to get sued into tomorrow over this - they sold Lightsquared a pig in a poke and made them spend million$ developing a worthless product.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        I'm guessing that assigning the adjacent spectrum wasn't an issue for the others since it was a low power spectrum. But then Light Squared tries to use it for high power and that messes up everything.
                        Pat
                        Paragon
                        1999 4788

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Megawatts and Milliwatts on directly adjoining frequencies seems like a reason for concern to me.

                          Lightsquared tried to grease the government wheels saying they would pay to replace goverrnment owned GPS receivers.

                          For you and I, they said plug in a simple filter to fix the issue.

                          Plug it in where? Has anyone seen a slot on their plotter to plug in this vaporware filter?

                          What filter?

                          When will these filters appear after one of us is on the rocks?

                          Are you guys prepared to replace your boat's expensive plotter, your GPS in the car?

                          How about GPS units installed in farm machines, contruction equipement, aircraft and a great many other devices?

                          Maybe Lightsquared would have been a great thing but it would have cost us more than our gain.
                          Jim McNeely
                          New Hope a 2004 Bayliner 305 Sunbridge Express Cruiser
                          Twin 5.7s with Bravo2 drives
                          Brighton, Michigan USA
                          MMSI # 367393410

                          Comment


                            #14
                            This is basically how it went:

                            10 years ago: Hey GPS industry, there's adjacent spectrum that should be used for other things, and you need to PUT IN THE FILTERS YOU SHOULD HAVE to start with.

                            GPS industry: No, it costs and extra dollar.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              SwampNut wrote:
                              This is basically how it went:

                              10 years ago: Hey GPS industry, there's adjacent spectrum that should be used for other things, and you need to PUT IN THE FILTERS YOU SHOULD HAVE to start with.

                              GPS industry: No, it costs and extra dollar.
                              Interesting perspective, you wouldn't happen to be in the industry would you?? Perhaps with an axe to grind?? Like in the thread about unlimited wifi??

                              As a business man would you voluntarily spend more company money if it was requested and not required??

                              If so, how would you justify it to your stockholders??

                              Just trying to point out the other side and not a personal attack, in fact I'm in Tempe from Seattle working in Paradise Valley for a year or three and I'd love to meet up and buy you a beer or six

                              thom

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