2855 5.7l won(39)t start-gctid401271

[Guest]

Hello all.

Just taken delivery of a 2855, purchased the boat blind.. Guy said engine was good. So i took a chance..

Tried starting the engine with fresh batteries but cranking VERY SLOW and won't fire up, fuel is getting up and also tried starting fluid. Then we removed all spark plugs, which looked fine visually but had orange spark, then turned the engine by hand using a wrench via the flywheel which was VERY HARD to turn (is this normal?).

All i know is of this engine is that it definitely worked a year ago because of receipts i found on the boat, also it's from Miami, where i guess it doesn't freeze. Without history its so hard to diagnose, i have emailed the guy for any info but i doubt he'll respond...

Engine will crank but SLOW

Orange spark from plugs

Cranking by hand possible but VERY TOUGH. (Impossible with plugs still in)

Oil looks suspiciously clean

Tried fresh Gasoline

Tried new ignition coil

Please, can anyone help?

Video link to youtube, you will here the engine had a little flutter at the beginning.

http://youtu.be/wVa82dV52m0

Thanks,

Jonathan

[Guest]

Tough to diagnose especially over the internet. But here is what we know. From looking at your U-Tube you're definitely not turning over fast enough to start. But since you're turning over and you've had the plugs out we can eliminate hydro lock or frozen engine. I assume what you meant by turning over by hand you were using a wrench on the front pulley nut - that's tough to do in my experience no matter what the engine condition. But if it was me, I'd pull the plugs again, squirt a couple tablespoons of 5 or 10 weight oil or even spray some engine fogging oil in all of the cylinders, and turn the engine over by hand and see if you feel any difference. What I might suspect is rusty cylinder walls caused by non-use in a hot humid environment(Florida) - hence a good reason to fog all engines before going into storage no matter what the environment. Beyond that we get into all sorts of issues like valves not opening properly, cam issues, cracked crankshaft yadda yadda - so let's hope it's just that Florida humidity doing it's worst! Wish I could be more help, but check back as I'm sure there will be other posters with more/better ideas.

[Guest]

captjmh wrote:
Tough to diagnose especially over the internet. But here is what we know. From looking at your U-Tube you're definitely not turning over fast enough to start. But since you're turning over and you've had the plugs out we can eliminate hydro lock or frozen engine. I assume what you meant by turning over by hand you were using a wrench on the front pulley nut - that's tough to do in my experience no matter what the engine condition. But if it was me, I'd pull the plugs again, squirt a couple tablespoons of 5 or 10 weight oil or even spray some engine fogging oil in all of the cylinders, and turn the engine over by hand and see if you feel any difference. What I might suspect is rusty cylinder walls caused by non-use in a hot humid environment(Florida) - hence a good reason to fog all engines before going into storage no matter what the environment. Beyond that we get into all sorts of issues like valves not opening properly, cam issues, cracked crankshaft yadda yadda - so let's hope it's just that Florida humidity doing it's worst! Wish I could be more help, but check back as I'm sure there will be other posters with more/better ideas.

Thanks very much for the reply.

Yes, we were turning the motor over using a wrench on the front pulley. Could the problem be a bad starter motor?

Can we spray WD40 into the plug holes or a little diesel?

Just to add, we used a foot and half long power bar to turn it, was very tough, is it normal?

Checked the gears and seems to shift in and out OK.

Thanks, Jon

[2850Bounty]

Basing this on a hunch and the sound of your starter motor, does your starter motor look like either of these, and does it have a small bracket near the front of it that braces to the engine block?





If so, and if you replace it, go with one of the HTGR/PMGR starter motors.

I'd not spend a dime on over-hauling this style motor.

Also, you were apparently turning the engine over with a wrench via the front harmonic balancer center bolt.

DO NOT do this.

.

[Guest]

2850Bounty wrote:
Basing this on a hunch and the sound of your starter motor, does your starter motor look like either of these, and does it have a small bracket near the front of it that braces to the engine block?





If so, and if you replace it, go with one of the HTGR/PMGR starter motors.

I'd not spend a dime on over-hauling this style motor.

Also, you were apparently turning the engine over with a wrench via the front harmonic balancer center bolt.

DO NOT do this.

.

Thanks again for reply.

Yes the bottom starter is the same as ours. we had the starter off and it looks in a bad way.

Please advise, We did turn the engine at the harmonic balancer center bolt, it did feel like it was tightening up. How else can we turn the engine by hand?

Thanks,

Just to add, can i try the starter motor from my 7.4L Merc in the 5.7L?

Jon

[2850Bounty]

me&myboat wrote:

• 1 wrote:
• Yes the bottom starter is the same as ours. we had the starter off and it looks in a bad way.
• Please advise, We did turn the engine at the harmonic balancer center bolt, it did feel like it was tightening up. How else can we turn the engine by hand?
• Just to add, can i try the starter motor from my 7.4L Merc in the 5.7L?

Jon,

• 1 wrote:
• That confirms my suspicions.
• The torque spec for this bolt is 60 ft lb. If you exceed this, and were to break this bolt off, you'll be pulling the engine out to extract the bolt fragment. Not worth.
  
  Use a belt style strap wrench in the future.
  
  Or, rotate the engine in the oposite direction.
• If the 7.4L starter motor uses the staggered bolt pattern, then yes.
  
  You're only a few days and a few dollars away (some are under $100) from a new HTGR/PMGR motor. Why go to the trouble?

.

[Guest]

yes the 7.4 engaging cog looks to have the same pattern just more teeth, I just dont want to churn up the gear ring on the flywheel, as I am in the UK, parts for the bayliner are harder to source, we will get the starter tested at a local shop, to see if its faulty,

Thanks

jon

2850Bounty wrote:
Jon,

• 1 wrote:
• That confirms my suspicions.
• The torque spec for this bolt is 60 ft lb. If you exceed this, and were to break this bolt off, you'll be pulling the engine out to extract the bolt fragment. Not worth.
  
  Use a belt style strap wrench in the future.
  
  Or, rotate the engine in the oposite direction.
• If the 7.4L starter motor uses the staggered bolt pattern, then yes.
  
  You're only a few days and a few dollars away (some are under $100) from a new HTGR/PMGR motor. Why go to the trouble?

.

[Guest]

Tried new starter and fresh batteries but same symptoms, slow cranking. my cousin is going to try and lube the cyclinders by squirting WD40 down each plug hole.

I'm wondering if the damage is in fact HydroLock and that the problem was left so long that it has all rusted inside.

Any thoughts?

Jon

[Guest]

me&myboat wrote:
Tried new starter and fresh batteries but same symptoms, slow cranking. my cousin is going to try and lube the cyclinders by squirting WD40 down each plug hole.

I'm wondering if the damage is in fact HydroLock and that the problem was left so long that it has all rusted inside.

Any thoughts?

Jon

It wouldn't crank at all if salt water had been sitting in the cylinders for any amount of time. Ask me how I know! Orange spark-low voltage. How are all your battery connections, ground connections etc?

[Guest]

Did you make sure to thoroughly clean all battery connections at the switch, battery and starter? Have you connected the starter directly to the battery system with no other electronics or other connections? Could be something else drawing power and not leaving enough for the starter.

[dktool]

I'm wondering if the damage is in fact HydroLock and that the problem was left so long that it has all rusted inside.

Oil looks suspiciously clean

Spun / seized rod / crank bearings, rusted / seized pistons, ??You mentioned the oil looks new, that's the first thing people do after frying an engine, change the oil and hope for a magic cure.But at least the seller told you the engine was good. Sorry to say but I think you've been.........

http://baylinerownersclub.org/media/....jpg[/img]

[Guest]

me&myboat wrote:
...Cranking by hand possible but VERY TOUGH. (Impossible with plugs still in)

You should consider a bad u-joint or gimbal bearing in the outdrive. I believe these components spin even with the gear in neutral. It could cause such a condition.

[dktool]

You should consider a bad u-joint or gimbal bearing in the outdrive. I believe these components spin even with the gear in neutral. It could cause such a condition.

Valid point, remove 8 nuts, pull the leg and see if it spins. Worth trying if your feeling lucky.

[Guest]

do you have new batteries .if not get a couple of 105a batteries.i have for a smaller 5 litre.

are you sure the earths are good.

with a couple you can series them and if it spins slowly then theres a problem .

the drive will require pulling to take this out the question and buying blind is an expensive no no as you dont know if the blocks cracked either.if you can get the boat pulled the drive will require removing to take it out of the question of it being faulty.worst case scenario is a new block as this may be the just the start.once again new batteries is the best place to start.

look here; http://www.alpha-batteries.co.uk/lei...FccLfAod5yoAJw

[Guest]

dingdongs wrote:
do you have new batteries .if not get a couple of 105a batteries.i have for a smaller 5 litre.

are you sure the earths are good.

with a couple you can series them and if it spins slowly then theres a problem .

the drive will require pulling to take this out the question and buying blind is an expensive no no as you dont know if the blocks cracked either.if you can get the boat pulled the drive will require removing to take it out of the question of it being faulty.worst case scenario is a new block as this may be the just the start.once again new batteries is the best place to start.

look here; http://www.alpha-batteries.co.uk/lei...FccLfAod5yoAJw

Hi, thanks for the reply..

My friend has a 2855 in the same marina, so we whipped his batteries off his (2x110ah) that were fully charged that cranked his 7.4 merc with ease, tried them on mine (5.7) and still slow cranking.

Can you explain a little better what pulling the drive will take out the question means? What will pulling the drive off find out?

Today we will be trying batteries direct to starter and new earth. Did you look at Youtube vid? how do you think it sounds?

Thanks,

Jon