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    Brunswick to sell Sea Ray brand

    Interesting development...

    https://www.tradeonlytoday.com/manuf...sletter-120517
    Mocoondo
    2002 Bayliner 195 Capri "Sport"
    Mercruiser 5.0L V8 / Alpha I Gen II
    MMSI: 338091755

    #2
    Just caught it and you beat me to it.

    Matt Train
    BOC Site Team
    Chicagoland, IL

    Comment


    • baylineguy
      baylineguy commented
      Editing a comment
      Bayliner and Meridian gone in the personal MY segment. SeaRay had taken on a growing portion of it, why is Brunswick wanting to get out of it? Are there any production builders left other than Carver? Apparently it is a withering if not dying sport.

    #3
    This says allot for Brunswicks assessment of the larger and more expensive boat market.

    I just looked at Meridian...down to just two models.


    KEVIN SANDERS
    4788 LISAS WAY
    SEWARD, ALASKA

    Comment


      #4
      I think it says a lot for the boat market in general. We’ve been lead to believe things are great, but when Brunswick is selling off what is effectively their flagship brand, that speaks volumes.

      A majority of my boating is on one of the busiest waterways in the country with boat dealers representing virtually every mainstream brand available. I can’t remember the last time I saw someone in possession of a brand new boat. If they are out there, they are keeping them well hidden.
      Mocoondo
      2002 Bayliner 195 Capri "Sport"
      Mercruiser 5.0L V8 / Alpha I Gen II
      MMSI: 338091755

      Comment


        #5
        The marine market is NOT great, and this is an indicator.

        Sea Ray as a brand and a business is worth a ton of money. They have a globally recognized brand, and a reputation (In my opinion, NOT earned) for quality and value.

        Brunswick is a massive company with internal cost and financial metrics that are not published, and based on SR's product portfolio and direct experience with them, they are lacking in vision right now and also seem to have some quality issues across the entire lineup. YOu have the 230SLX that is a $100K boat with no built in head, and it competes with Cobalt which pretty much wipes the floor with them.

        And you have issues with product.

        You have the all new 230SPX which is on their website, units are in dealers, but I have no way of seeing the price through the configuration. All accounts seem to point to north of $80,000, which is not competitive.

        You have the 210 SPX which is not competitive with anything currently, and has 19 degrees of deadrise to competitors 20 degrees, no Bravo outdrive, and it's $60,000.

        Maybe this is Brunswick's way of saying they don't know what to do with SR, and would rather dump the money they would get from them into their other brands.
        Matt Train
        BOC Site Team
        Chicagoland, IL

        Comment


          #6
          Two problems with the boating market. First, despite what the politicians tell us, I don’t believe that the economy is all that strong for the average American consumer. The wealthy are not hurting but for the most of us, we don’t have loads of discretionary income to dump into a new boat. It seems that there are way more used boats around than you see new ones on docks at your local marina.

          Second, for 99% of the buying market, boats are a luxury item, not something that folks need to survive or run a business. Thus it becomes very difficult to justify spending what may be over half of your annual income on a new boat purchase. I think Brunswick is looking to diversify out of the marine markets in general and focus on some industry that is less cyclical and produces more consistent income. The Presidents message even indicated they are looking to maximize shareholder value.
          1990 2755 - sold
          2005 275 current vessel

          Comment


            #7
            Originally posted by Rick_Kenyon View Post
            Two problems with the boating market. First, despite what the politicians tell us, I don’t believe that the economy is all that strong for the average American consumer. The wealthy are not hurting but for the most of us, we don’t have loads of discretionary income to dump into a new boat. It seems that there are way more used boats around than you see new ones on docks at your local marina.

            Second, for 99% of the buying market, boats are a luxury item, not something that folks need to survive or run a business. Thus it becomes very difficult to justify spending what may be over half of your annual income on a new boat purchase. I think Brunswick is looking to diversify out of the marine markets in general and focus on some industry that is less cyclical and produces more consistent income. The Presidents message even indicated they are looking to maximize shareholder value.
            This speaks to the income gap.

            Boat prices are outstripping inflation and thus people's ability to buy them.

            I am hearing rumors of other contributing factors with SR, however.

            For the record, I did confirm with someone inside SR that the news is real.
            Matt Train
            BOC Site Team
            Chicagoland, IL

            Comment


              #8
              Originally posted by Rick_Kenyon View Post
              Two problems with the boating market. First, despite what the politicians tell us, I don’t believe that the economy is all that strong for the average American consumer. The wealthy are not hurting but for the most of us, we don’t have loads of discretionary income to dump into a new boat. It seems that there are way more used boats around than you see new ones on docks at your local marina.
              Quality and Value.

              Boat builders have made great strides with the quality side of the equation, but the value still isn't there. I get the itch every so often, but when you look at what they are asking for new boats these days...they are out of their minds.

              I do think the economy is drastically improved though. I certainly see and feel it myself. I haven't seen it so good or felt so confident about things in over a decade, but today's consumer is also a more educated, more demanding consumer.

              Mocoondo
              2002 Bayliner 195 Capri "Sport"
              Mercruiser 5.0L V8 / Alpha I Gen II
              MMSI: 338091755

              Comment


                #9
                Originally posted by Download_Complete View Post

                This speaks to the income gap.

                Boat prices are outstripping inflation and thus people's ability to buy them.

                I am hearing rumors of other contributing factors with SR, however.

                For the record, I did confirm with someone inside SR that the news is real.
                Well said, Matt . . . . this is going to drive used boat prices UP higher than they already were . . . as has been the pathway established by used pickup trucks (for example) versus buying a new machine.
                This is what Boat Test has published, as well: http://www.boattest.com/view-news/56...mpany-for-sale It's a pretty in depth discussion of the boating industry and what has happened over the years.
                1998 Avanti 3685 - "Dad's Dream" w 454 Mercs - just a rockin' an'a rollin'
                Former - "Home Aweigh" 2003 - 2452 Bayliner Cierra Classic Hardtop Cruiser
                WQQM835 MMSI: 338147209
                James H. Stradling

                Comment


                  #10
                  "Sea Ray Boats was founded by Cornelius Nathaniel "CN" Ray III, in 1959 in Oxford, Mich., at the dawn of the fiberglass boat-building era. When he sold the company in 1986, it had 4,500 employees and sales of $400 million.

                  In 2016, fewer than 2,500 Sea Rays were sold in the U.S., according to a reliable industry source. During a conference call after the announcement yesterday, a Brunswick spokesperson said that projected 2017 Sea Ray sales are $380,000 and that volume in terms of units was flat. Further, it was said that Sea Ray had been operating at a loss."


                  $380K in revenues? There has to be something wrong with that number. I run what can only be described as a "small business" and my revenues are at least 10 times that number. They can't even pay the help with those numbers.
                  Mocoondo
                  2002 Bayliner 195 Capri "Sport"
                  Mercruiser 5.0L V8 / Alpha I Gen II
                  MMSI: 338091755

                  Comment


                    #11
                    I think that used boats are new larger boats big competition.

                    For example a 28’ 2000-2005 era 2859 would be a hundred or hundred and fifty thousand dollar new boat today.
                    Yet someone that wants one can buy a perfectly good example for what, $25K???

                    My 4788 sold new in 2001 for right at $350K. Today a new 4788 would cost probably $750+
                    Yet perfectly good examples can be had for a bit less than $200K

                    Unlike a automobile, a large boat is generally not designed to have a “lifespan”
                    How many 1980’s cars are still on the road?
                    Now go walk down the dock. Lots of 1980’s boats tied up at the dock.

                    Then you have a changing demographic. I grew up working on cars. Because of that I have no problem tearing into a boat engine, or replacing a pump.

                    My son on the other hand at 34 years old had a 24’ Bayliner. Great boat, head, sleeping area, etc... He sold it and bought a Alumanium boat with no head, and no sleeping, and a outboard motor for almost double what he had in the Bayliner cruiser.

                    His reason...He didn’t want the committment to maintenance a big boat requires. His alumanium boat is simple. It requires nothing of him until he launches it. It is fuel efficient, where his cruiser was a gas hog. He loves it, and will never buy another cruiser.

                    KEVIN SANDERS
                    4788 LISAS WAY
                    SEWARD, ALASKA

                    Comment


                      #12
                      $380K in revenues for 2017? Can anybody confirm that number? That seems so far off. If they are in that deep, then Sea Ray is done.
                      Mocoondo
                      2002 Bayliner 195 Capri "Sport"
                      Mercruiser 5.0L V8 / Alpha I Gen II
                      MMSI: 338091755

                      Comment


                        #13
                        Originally posted by Mocoondo View Post
                        In 2016, fewer than 2,500 Sea Rays were sold in the U.S., according to a reliable industry source. During a conference call after the announcement yesterday, a Brunswick spokesperson said that projected 2017 Sea Ray sales are $380,000 and that volume in terms of units was flat. Further, it was said that Sea Ray had been operating at a loss."

                        $380K in revenues? There has to be something wrong with that number. I run what can only be described as a "small business" and my revenues are at least 10 times that number. They can't even pay the help with those numbers.
                        if 2017 sales are close to 2016 in units, at an average NEW price of $50,000 per copy (which is probably a very, very low average price,)revenues for 2017 would have to approximate $125,000,000.
                        2500
                        x $50,000 = $125,000,000. $380,000 is way too low based on 2016 unit volume. I think the Brunswick spokesperson was given a slightly incorrect number.
                        1990 2755 - sold
                        2005 275 current vessel

                        Comment


                          #14
                          Originally posted by Rick_Kenyon View Post

                          if 2017 sales are close to 2016 in units, at an average NEW price of $50,000 per copy (which is probably a very, very low average price,)revenues for 2017 would have to approximate $125,000,000.
                          2500
                          x $50,000 = $125,000,000. $380,000 is way too low based on 2016 unit volume.
                          That's how my math hashes out. Either that article is wrong or SR didn't sell a thing this year.
                          Mocoondo
                          2002 Bayliner 195 Capri "Sport"
                          Mercruiser 5.0L V8 / Alpha I Gen II
                          MMSI: 338091755

                          Comment


                            #15
                            Originally posted by Mocoondo View Post

                            That's how my math hashes out. Either that article is wrong or SR didn't sell a thing this year.
                            Lol, Donald would call that article “fake news”.
                            1990 2755 - sold
                            2005 275 current vessel

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