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Smart Tabs / Trim Tabs invalidate Lifetime Hull Warranty-gctid794958

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    Smart Tabs / Trim Tabs invalidate Lifetime Hull Warranty-gctid794958

    Had a discussion with Bayliner Customer Service about an issue with caulking on 2016 Element XL. Rich Gentry from Bayliner was very helpful. However during our conversation I asked if Bayliner had issued a bulletin about the water intrusion issue found on some Elements. I told him I put smart tabs on my boat and he mentioned that would invalidate warranty for that area if it ever became soft. He said, if not installed from factory, or purchased with boat installed by dealer then the warranty would be invalidated for that area of the hull/transom. I asked about my transducer for my fish finder that I installed. Same thing invalidates warranty.

    I feel this should not be the case unless improperly installed and was the contributing factor for the failure. This could be said about a number of aftermarket parts that penetrate the hull.

    I love my Element but this is not good news.

    Thought i should share this so you don't modify boat without knowing. And consider another manufacturer if this is deal breaker.
    2016 Bayliner Element XL 115hp Mercury Fourstroke

    #2
    Toon, I think the key is your comment about improperly installed. If the fasteners are properly bedded and maintained, there's a 99% chance, an unscientific guess, there will be no issues. The manufacturer, any manufacturer, can control installation methods in the factory or by a dealer. If a dealer or authorized shop doesn't do it correctly, the manufacturer collects the cost of repairs from the dealer or shop either by having the dealer repair their screwup or sending them the bill if corrected by another dealer.

    I'm not defending the manufacturers or dealers, just posing the question of how they can guarantee my work. I don't even do that.

    Just my stupid opinion and observation.
    P/C Pete
    Edmonds Yacht Club (Commodore 1993)
    1988 3818 "GLAUBEN”
    Hino EH700 175 Onan MDKD Genset
    1980 Encounter Sunbridge "Misty Blue" (Sold)
    MMSI 367770440
    1972 Chevrolet Nova Frame off Resto-mod in the garage
    Boating on the Salish Sea since 1948

    Comment


      #3
      "Pcpete" post=794975 wrote:
      Toon, I think the key is your comment about improperly installed. [color]#ff0000 wrote:
      If the fasteners are properly bedded and maintained, there's a 99% chance, an unscientific guess, there will be no issues.[/color] The manufacturer, any manufacturer, can control installation methods in the factory or by a dealer. If a dealer or authorized shop doesn't do it correctly, the manufacturer collects the cost of repairs from the dealer or shop either by having the dealer repair their screwup or sending them the bill if corrected by another dealer.

      I'm not defending the manufacturers or dealers, just posing the question of how they can guarantee my work. I don't even do that.

      Just my stupid opinion and observation.
      True, kinda makes you wonder why Bayliner offers the warranty then. The hull of any manufacturer should last a "lifetime" if you don't put any holes in it that might leak. :huh:

      Comment


        #4
        Magnusson-Moss 101. If your modification caused a failure, then why should the manufacturer cover it? if your modification didn't cause a failure, and the failure is otherwise covered by the warranty, then the modification cannot "void" the warranty.

        The problem of course is one of proof, and I think that bayliner like any other manufacturer is going to shift the burden onto the one who did the modification.

        Comment


          #5
          You're right it would take lawsuit and burden of proof would be on me.
          2016 Bayliner Element XL 115hp Mercury Fourstroke

          Comment


            #6
            I personally don't consider anybody's warranty to be worth much. Realistically they all seem to find some sort of "out" and if none exists they simply create one. That's just the way it is. If it's a simple one off fix here and there they stand behind their product yet if it is something widespread and is a real defect or manufacturing flaw they will find some way to sleaze out typically by blaming the customer.

            I would say you are essentially on your own so make sure you do it right. The trouble with those elements, which I know absolutely nothing about, is that they do have a track record of water intrusion. That single thing alone would be something to seriously consider.

            As for sleaze take a look at Hyundai. Their Sonatas started blowing engines in large number a few years back most still under warranty. Then the games began. Oh you used other than Hyundai oil filters. denied. They even went so far as to put out a SB stating that owners needed OEM Hyundai filters due to circulation issues with some others. This went on for a long time with people getting robbed blind paying $5K for a new engine because the #2 cylinder seemed to snap it's connecting rod while others lost oil pressure. All of them had severe bearing scoring. Of course all along Hyundai was studying these engines but no explanation given while denying most warranty claims..

            Long story short some guys took theirs apart of made surethey were standing there when it came apart and they saw millings in the pan, filter or wherever It doesn't take a genius for a motorhead to see the difference between metal millings and shattered engine parts. Hyundai still denied claims by the hundreds wherever they could though until somebody got smart. They filed reports with the Nat Highway Safety Institute claiming a caging engine created an extreme safety hazard due to loss of power (electric) steering and power brakes . When NHSI started investigating suddenly Hyundai reverses itself.

            Right out of the clear blue sky someone suddenly finds, after a few years :whistle: that their brand new factory in Alabama they bragged about just happened to be using a new process in their engine blocks on Sonatas. After milling the rough block castings instead of washing them out with oil they started using compressed air. I guess the air wasn't quite enough so that some millings were left inside and they often trashed the bearings in short order. After this they started honoring their commitment :sick:

            Funny but it gets even better. Now mine was made after the date they switched back to the better process yet Hyundai bombards me with deals to buy their Extended Warranty. I say no politely a couple times but they just won't go away . After the 4th call I get nasty with this clown on the phone and really tell him off and they eventually go away. A few months later Hyundai announces a blanket 100 K blanket free retroactivew warranty on their cars Now imagine that :whistle: ! And people wonder why I don't trust any corporation where $$$ is concerned. Warranties , yea sure. :angry:

            Comment


              #7
              "xxtoon" post=794958 wrote:
              I told him I put smart tabs on my boat and he mentioned, blah, blah, blah....
              So did those smart tabs improve the ride quality and time to plane?

              Details please.
              2016 75hp Element 160 w/ Smart Tabs & Sponson Drains

              Comment


                #8
                Absolutely. Planes at 14-15mph. Less bow wander. Really recommend them. Might have to try the different position settings to get the way you like. I like it on 2nd position.
                2016 Bayliner Element XL 115hp Mercury Fourstroke

                Comment


                  #9
                  Glad I came across this thread. I'm having issues with water in the sponsons and now my Element is back at the dealer to try and figure out why water is still in the sponsons after the drains were installed. I currently have new Smart Tabs and a new transducer to install. I really hope they dont try to pull this crap on me. Now that read this I will make sure they fix the water issue before i do any transom installs. This sucks and its a bit stressful..

                  Comment


                    #10
                    "Pcpete" post=794975 wrote:
                    ... If the fasteners are properly bedded and maintained, there's a 99% chance, an unscientific guess, there will be no issues. ...
                    The issue is that even most dealers do not properly bed fasteners. If the fiberglass is cored it needs to be drilled slightly oversize. All core within 1/4 inch of the hole needs to be removed (I use a dremel with a router bit to do this). Thickened epoxy is then injected into the hole. Once set, the hole can be re-drilled using the correct size bit.

                    I've seen many installations done by dealers and repair shops. In most cases they did not follow the above steps. Usually they just drill a hole, shoot a bit of 5200 in it, and screw the fastener in.
                    1999 3788, Cummins 270 "Freedom"
                    2013 Boston Whaler 130 SS
                    Anacortes, WA

                    Comment


                      #11
                      If you look at the threads on transoms being rebuilt, they are boats from the 90's and older. It takes a long time for water to rot wood encased in fiberglass. Very few original owners keep boats that long.
                      Esteban
                      B-ham!
                      Former Bayliners 3218, 2859, 2252, 1952

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