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trouble stopping my trailer-gctid385898

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  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    Maybe nothing was wrong. .........

    your towing 7 500 lbs. The front disc are just a bit more grabby than the rear or trailer drums.

    $hit happens

    Nice new ride!!!

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  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    I purchased a used 3/4 ton truck shown in the picture. It has a V-10 engine and big brakes (I think disks on all wheels). The increased power and control take a lot of the stress out of towing.

    [img]/media/kunena/attachments/vb/801190=39843-2013_boat_and_truck_e.jpg[/img]

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  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    Not to beat a dead horse, but I noticed that your 278 has a 7.4L big block engine. that is a hundred or two lbs more than the SBC 5.0 & 5.7 engines.

    Also, we have a tandum axle trailer for our 2355. It has tandum 3500 lb axles with drum brakes on the front. The boat tended to push forward on the trailer with the front riding up the front roller actually pushing the CG back & unweighting those front brakes. I installed a strap with winch to go from the bow eye straight down to the front post. That helped a lot with the boat and keeps down the locking up of those front brakes. I also mounted my two spare wheels up forward to increase the tongue weight. I don't want to push the boat forward any more since the rear rollers are right at the transom now. Rear trailer brakes would be a big help. We have to bury the wheels in the water to get the boat on and off so after that they tend to lock up easier. When travelling with trailer empty we turn the fluid switch sideways to disable the trailer brakes.

    We've towed with a '96 suburban 2500/7.4L and '01 excursion 7.3L diesel. The sag at the rear bumper of either of those vehicles is like 1". With our first vehicle an older Jeep Grand Wagonner, the sag was 6". We didn't use that very long!

    The thing about surge brakes is that the tow vehicle must have good enough braking to intiate the surge to get the rear brakes working. the brakes on our two tow vehicles have worked great for that.

    Don

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  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    Not to discount the benefits of brakes on two axles, but looking strictly at California law, both the RoadKing website and the CA DMV say:

    26302. (a) Every trailer or semitrailer, manufactured and first registered after January 1, 1940, and having a gross weight of 6,000 pounds or more and which is operated at a speed of 20 miles per hour or over shall be equipped with brakes.

    (b) Every trailer or semitrailer manufactured and first registered after January 1, 1966, and having a gross weight of 3,000 pounds or more shall be equipped with brakes on at least two wheels.

    (c) Every trailer or semitrailer manufactured after January 1, 1982, and equipped with air brakes shall be equipped with brakes on all wheels.

    (d) Brakes required on trailers or semitrailers shall be adequate, supplemental to the brakes on the towing vehicle, to enable the combination of vehicles to comply with the stopping distance requirements of Section 26454.


    ... and Section 26454 says:

    [This table shows the maximum stopping distance in feet for certains types of vehicles when moving at an initial speed of 20 miles per hour.] *

    [Vehicle type] * Maximum Stopping Distance (feet)

    (1) Any passenger vehicle 25

    (2) Any single motor vehicle with a manufacturer's gross vehicle weight rating of less than 10,000 lbs. 30

    (3) Any combination of vehicles consisting of a passenger vehicle or any motor vehicle with a manufacturer's gross vehicle weight rating of less than 10,000 lbs. in combination with any trailer, semitrailer or trailer coach 40

    (4) Any single motor vehicle with a manufacturer's gross vehicle weight rating of 10,000 lbs. or more or any bus 40

    (5) All other combinations of vehicles 50


    Interesting that this spec has not been revised in decades and seems incredibly lax.

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  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    captharv wrote:
    ... Lets say some bozo pulls out right in front of you. So you climb on the brakes but skid into him. You could be charged with at least partial fault, even though his act started the whole thing.
    Yes, that is one of my main worries. I'll look at making some changes.

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  • captharv
    replied
    I had a 1985 chap 238 XLC on a E Z Loader 64 roller steel trailer. It weighed out at close to 7500 (public scale.

    The trailer alone was about 1800#. I would say your rig is closewr to 8200

    my trailer came with the brakes only on the front axle. It did exactly what you are experiencing.

    SO, 1st, I added a weight distributing set up. Night and day difference in both braking and ride.

    Heres the dynamics. When stopping, the CG of the weight shifts toward the front of the vehicle. In the case of the tow,the boat/trailer is almost 1 1/2 times the weight of the truck. So it presses down on the truck rear and lifts the front, thus letting the front skid. (It also makes steering a bit squirrely). The equalizer acts as a set of overload springs and cancels out some of the tongue weight.

    Another thing. Mostly all newer trucks (My 2001 expedition included) are rated for towing with and w/o the equalizer. In my case its rated 8900# with a 800# tongue weight WITH the equalizer, and 5000 and 500 w/o. Besides, the equalizer set up really smooths out the ride a lot, as well as inproving handling and braking.

    Now, the trailer itself. In 2005 Florida required brakes on all axles of a tandem trailer. I added the "kit" for the rear axle. Again, a night and day difference.

    In your case, I would recommend going to wheel disk brakes on the trailer.

    championtrailer.com out of Slidel La has kits for this with everything you need. Bite the bullet and get it right the first time.

    The big problem with surge brakes is: The towing vehicle brake system myust work perfectly. Lifting of the truck front is not perfectly.......

    When I replced my trailer on the 2452 I bought an aluminum, 8200# carrying weight, 4 wheel disks, radial tires, tortion suspension magic tilt. It rides so smooth that you can almost forget its there.

    Another thing to consider. Lets say some bozo pulls out right in front of you. So you climb on the brakes but skid into him. You could be charged with at least partial fault, even though his act started the whole thing.

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  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    when was the last time you bled the trailer brakes? you may not be getting full pressure to the wheel cylinders. Also, check for water intrusion into the master cyl. on the trailer

    pat

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  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    2010 Ford F-150 TOWING (Pounds)

    Regular Cab

    126 inch WB 145 inch WB

    4x2 4x4 4x2 4x4

    GVWR

    4.6L 2V 6,450 6,650 6,750 6,950

    4.6L 3V -- 6,750 6,850 7,050

    5.4L -- 6,800 7,050 7,200

    5.4L HD pkg -- -- 8,200 8,200

    Read more: [url]http://www.trucktrend.com/features/tech/163_0907_2010_ford_f150_tech_spec/viewall.html#ixzz2RWBxWVkp[url]

    My 2004 F-150 has 4 wheel heavy duty disc brakes (4x2 4.6L) and 6500 would be max. For 7500-8000+, a bigger engine would do it, but I would opt for a F250, I think.

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  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    Once you put fluids and normal gear in the boat, it's probably heavier than you think. Typical 26-28' boats weigh around 7k-8k alone. Add fluids and normal gear. Then add about 1500-1800 pounds for the trailer.

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  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    if I identified the truck right from the picture it's a Dodge RAM1500 and the lowest rating is 7550lbs. With a different gear ratio it can go up to 8500lbs. Not that I think it's safe to tow that much with it (I had one and know) but at least it's rated that way.

    The biggest joke: the new Ford F-150 with the green scooter engine can be had rated up to 11300lbs!

    What truck is towed by this trailer??

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  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    SwampNut wrote:
    That old truck is overloaded, AND you need to have brakes on all four wheels of your trailer. The front tires were skidding because they were trying to take the entire force of the boat and trailer, which was too much.
    +1. 7400lb is too much weight for a 1/2 ton, imo.

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  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    That old truck is overloaded, AND you need to have brakes on all four wheels of your trailer. The front tires were skidding because they were trying to take the entire force of the boat and trailer, which was too much.

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  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    2850Bounty wrote:
    Boy Dave, I couldn't agree more with that.

    I recall seeing my first weight distributing hitch back in the 60's, if memory serves me.

    At the time, I thought it was pretty neat.

    But then after giving it some thought, I determined that these were a band-aid fix for a much larger issue.

    I feel the same way today.
    I couldn't agree more! My opinion is even worse as the weight distribution hitches change the entire suspension geometry of the tow vehicle by stiffening the connection.

    The only real way out is to design the trailer right to start with. Make the tongue that long that you need very low tongue weight to start with. Design it so it's stable with 2-3% of the trailer weight and the rest just follows by laws of Physics.

    Last weekend I played with my trailer to determine the correct tongue length (besides installing the latest solar vent system). Not the best construction as I just added another piece of folding tongue which I would never permanently use. The boat was left just where it sat and only the tongue extended until I hit my 2.5% goal. The permanent installation of a 2.5' longer tongue moved to the highest priority! Sure, a longer trailer is more difficult to get around corners but you just have to know that you need a bit more space.

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  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    I don't know if I mentioned it yet, but with the reworked drum brakes on the front axle, the new trailer master cylinder - it made a world of difference. The stopping is very good. I also replaced worn drum slave cylinders at the rear wheels of the truck and bled the fluid - that helps a lot too.

    wildman wrote:
    Leveling out the load sounds good, and is next on my list. That should raise the ball mount about 6 inches and help level out the trailer (see picture).
    I just towed the boat for the first time with the Load Leveler shocks on the rear. The rear sags much less now with the new shocks, and the unloaded ride is not much stiffer than it was before. In short, they work great!

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  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    Jeff H wrote:
    ...The correct ball height is the height that your trailer is level at when hitched to your tow rig- simple.

    It sounds like you need to get a drop mount and level out that load.
    Leveling out the load sounds good, and is next on my list. That should raise the ball mount about 6 inches and help level out the trailer (see picture). But if anything, it seems like I need to raise the hitch a few inches. My plan is to add Monroe load adjusting shocks (see picture) if I keep the truck.

    I was evaluating the 3/4 ton trucks and I don't see how they would solve my unloaded front wheel problem. For example, the basic 1996 Ram 3500 offers 2000 pounds more in towing capacity than the 1500, but I do not see how it can be much heavier than mine in the front. Am I missing something here? I could see how a big dualy or Suburban 2500 would help and maybe that is what I will need to get.

    Attached files http://baylinerownersclub.org/media/....jpg[/img] http://baylinerownersclub.org/media/....jpg[/img]

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