Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Should I drain antifeeze?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    #16
    Originally posted by Waterdowg View Post

    Yep those were his words. The directions were:
    Run the engine on the muffs to warm up and the special blend of fuel though the system. Once done drain the block and introduce anti-freeze though the muffs until it is seen coming out of the exhaust. Then followed by the disclaimer to have the dealer do it so if something is done wrong you can blame them.
    I had asked if there was a benefit to switch to a Closed System he said no not as far as winterizing the engine goes.
    ah the first time you left out, the part I put in bold print...if you drain the block...that method will work because it eliminates the unknown factor of the thermostat opening or not. Its still easier in my opinion to manually drain first, poke holes, and replace the plugs then fill with AF via the hoses.
    88 Four Winns 200 Horizon 4.3 OMC
    98 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0/Selectrac
    07 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 Hemi/Quadradrive II

    Long Island Sound Region

    Comment


      #17
      Originally posted by 88fourwinns View Post

      ah the first time you left out, the part I put in bold print...if you drain the block...that method will work because it eliminates the unknown factor of the thermostat opening or not. Its still easier in my opinion to manually drain first, poke holes, and replace the plugs then fill with AF via the hoses.
      I'm sorry I thought I had typed that. To many thought in my head.
      2016 Bayliner 215 Deck Boat
      Mercruiser 4.3 220 HP Alpha 1 Gen II

      2003 SeaRay 176 SRX Bowrider
      Mercruiser 3.0 135 HP Alpha 1 Gen II

      1988 Sunbird 170 Bowrider
      Evinrude 88 Special

      1970 Salem Skiff 13.5 foot
      1992 Johnson 40HP.

      Comment


        #18
        I have the 4.3 TKS with (5) blue drain plugs. I ran the boat on the muffs with water until the "TKS shut off" 175 degrees. I then raised the RPMs a bit over 1000 for a few mins longer, then shut it off. I then removed all 5 plugs and let it drain. I put the plugs back in, hooked up the jug with pink RV anti freeze (5 gallons) and ran it until until it ran almost out, then I fogged it. My original plan was to then leave it full of antifreeze, but I think I will drain it again. It seems less risky that way.

        It would seem to me all one should need to do is to remove the 5 blue plugs and drain it. My guess is that these plugs are located at the key low spots in the system, hence there wouldn't be any way damage could occur during a freeze. Even if the small amount of water left behind were to freeze, it would have plenty of room to expand. Someone who knows more about the internal passages of an engine may be able to confirm this.
        1973 Rinker Trihull 115hp Mercury OB
        1974 Caravelle Trihull 165 hp I/O
        1986 Baja 180 170HP Mercruiser
        2012 Bayliner 195 BR 4.3 TKS

        Comment


        • 88fourwinns
          88fourwinns commented
          Editing a comment
          That should be fine. If you read the Mercruiser shop manual they will usually say something like this:
          you use the drain system to prevent FREEZE damage
          you add antifreeze (proper antifreeze with corrosion inhibitors) to reduce CORROSION damage

          notice they are not saying to use antifreeze to prevent freeze damage. because it doesn't really unless you drain properly first!

        #19
        I have tested both the -50 and -60 in the freezer at zero degrees F. What I found was that both got hard at that temp but didn't burst the plastic container. However, plastic has a bit of give in it, whereas cast iron has none. That's why I always used -100 in the past. Stays liquid in the freezer.


        On the West Marine site they list the tech specs of the antifreezes they sell:

        for -50, it is recommended for low temps between 14-18*F
        for -60, it is recommended for low temps between 7-10*F
        for colder regions (that includes us since we do get colder as low as zero or slightly below) they recommend the -100.

        Keep in mind that these are bust temps of copper pipe specs, they start to freeze at higher temps than those listed. Both the -50 and -60 are solid at zero, the -100 is supposed to not get solid till a frigid -55*F.

        So I always used -100, but was getting tired of paying 12-14 bucks a gallon for it. So investigated an alternative solution last fall:
        Sierra Brand PG engine antifreeze. This is an engine antifreeze that can be used for engine cooling systems, it is no tox and has corrosion inhibitors. It is about 15 bucks a gallon but you mix it 50/50 with water which gives you freeze protection down to -26F* which is more than sufficient for most of the US, and you can go up to 60 or 70% if you need to. At 50% the cost drops to about 7.50 a gallon which is only about 1.50 more than the -60 stuff.

        Last year I used the Sierra stuff and it is fine, I just mixed up a batch this week for this fall's winterization.

        I see no point at all in using AF if you are going to drain it. The only time you would do that is if there is a low area in a cooling line for a cooler (p/s cooler, fuel cooler on newer engines) and you can't get the drain plug out, or can't get the hoses off. Then yes, you pour -100 through it to push out the water or else face expensive repairs in spring.

        Otherwise, you manually drain and poke all holes, disconnect hoses as necessary. Any water that did not drain can harmlessly expand.

        I leave it in because it keeps air out and reduces corrosion.

        Here's an analogy:
        In 2005 my neighbor bought a new boat and trailer. Both were maintained by a boat yard and the last time I saw the trailer it looked like it needed new springs. Not getting sprayed with corrosion inhibitor at all.
        In about the same time frame I put new springs on our trailer, usually 2x a year I spray it with Corrosion X or Boeshield whatever I have at the time. All those years later, the springs on mine have nearly no corrosion at all.
        So, the point of antifreeze is CORROSION INHIBITION. NOT FREEZE PROTECTION.
        Corrosion Inhibition works in my opinion.

        100% salt water use, the boat has been on a salt water mooring, 15+ years 6 months of the year.
        88 Four Winns 200 Horizon 4.3 OMC
        98 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0/Selectrac
        07 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 Hemi/Quadradrive II

        Long Island Sound Region

        Comment


          #20
          Over the past few years I have been considering using antifreeze in my winterization process. Here is a picture of the hoses attached to my thermostat housing of 2016 4.3 MPI. There are 4 hoses. Would I disconnect and pour down all 4 or just a few? I have label each hose A-D. What would be the best process to pour antifreeze in the engine.
          Attached Files
          2016 Bayliner 215 Deck Boat
          Mercruiser 4.3 220 HP Alpha 1 Gen II

          2003 SeaRay 176 SRX Bowrider
          Mercruiser 3.0 135 HP Alpha 1 Gen II

          1988 Sunbird 170 Bowrider
          Evinrude 88 Special

          1970 Salem Skiff 13.5 foot
          1992 Johnson 40HP.

          Comment


            #21
            First question how cold is the coldest anticipated temp you will get? This determines which AF you should use....
            88 Four Winns 200 Horizon 4.3 OMC
            98 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0/Selectrac
            07 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 Hemi/Quadradrive II

            Long Island Sound Region

            Comment


            • Waterdowg
              Waterdowg commented
              Editing a comment
              I'm in North Jersey so it has dropped to -10/-15 in the past. I was looking at the -100

            #22
            An issue many have brought up is not knowing for sure if your thermostat has opened or not. For those here who know more about this than I do. When I removed the 5 blue plugs immediately after running it to 175 degrees on the temp gauge. The raw water was scalding hot coming out of each of the 5 drain holes. Can I assume that had the thermostat not opened, that at least a couple of those drains would NOT have been scalding hot?
            1973 Rinker Trihull 115hp Mercury OB
            1974 Caravelle Trihull 165 hp I/O
            1986 Baja 180 170HP Mercruiser
            2012 Bayliner 195 BR 4.3 TKS

            Comment


              #23
              When the Thermostat opens what happens is that the big hose to the circ pump will get hotter as will the feed hoses to the manis because the open thermostat allow hot water out of the engine and then regulates that flow to maintain a steady 160*. So it will open but only enough to maintain that temp, that’s why using the suck up the af up the drive method is risky. You never know just how far open it is.

              I know marinas use use this method but what they do is re circulate the af to keep it hot enough to keep the stat open.
              using that simple tank will not achieve this. Don’t take short cuts if you are new at this.
              88 Four Winns 200 Horizon 4.3 OMC
              98 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0/Selectrac
              07 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.7 Hemi/Quadradrive II

              Long Island Sound Region

              Comment


                #24
                Originally posted by Hammerdrill View Post
                I have the 4.3 TKS with (5) blue drain plugs. I ran the boat on the muffs with water until the "TKS shut off" 175 degrees. I then raised the RPMs a bit over 1000 for a few mins longer, then shut it off. I then removed all 5 plugs and let it drain. I put the plugs back in, hooked up the jug with pink RV anti freeze (5 gallons) and ran it until until it ran almost out, then I fogged it. My original plan was to then leave it full of antifreeze, but I think I will drain it again. It seems less risky that way.

                It would seem to me all one should need to do is to remove the 5 blue plugs and drain it. My guess is that these plugs are located at the key low spots in the system, hence there wouldn't be any way damage could occur during a freeze. Even if the small amount of water left behind were to freeze, it would have plenty of room to expand. Someone who knows more about the internal passages of an engine may be able to confirm this.
                My 07 205 BR with the 5L engine also has the 5 blue plugs. Alls I do it pull the plugs, haul the boat down to the gas station to add some sea foam and top the tank off. I figure the up/down side to side movement of hauling the boat get any water that might still be laying in the engine out. off then put the boat back in the shop, after a few weeks I put the plugs back in just to help keep air out of the system. I asked a boat mechanic friend of mine, and he said that's all I needed to do, no need for antifreeze. I've never had any issues doing it this way.

                Comment


                  #25
                  Just winterized since it was warm outside and front coming thru tomorrow. Will freeze for little while and didnt want to do the job in miserable weather.

                  did my usual drain all 4 plugs and poked openings while draining...removed lower hoses at circulating pump and impeller pump....then filled block and manifolds with AF....we get away with the pink stuff since it rarely gets to 20 degrees.

                  Plus mine is stored in shop...extra effort makes sleeping easier.

                  naturally, the winterizing property wasnt without issue....busted a water line in pasture so get to repair that in morning.
                  2008 H210SS Four Winns
                  Volvo Penta 5.7 GISX
                  Prior: 1997 2050SS Bayliner
                  Brad / Texas Gulf Coast

                  Comment


                    #26
                    What has been missed here is to lower the leg, or leave it down, when you are done. Rain water can enter through the prop and freeze around the prop shaft putting pressure on the aluminum case. It’s also better, IMO, on the bellows.
                    P/C Pete
                    Edmonds Yacht Club (Commodore 1993)
                    1988 3818 "GLAUBEN”
                    Hino EH700 175 Onan MDKD Genset
                    1980 Encounter Sunbridge "Misty Blue" (Sold)
                    MMSI 367770440
                    1972 Chevrolet Nova Frame off Resto-mod in the garage
                    Boating on the Salish Sea since 1948

                    Comment

                    Working...
                    X