Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

HELP! Element Mercury 60 CT Four Stroke Bogs/Shuts Off

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    HELP! Element Mercury 60 CT Four Stroke Bogs/Shuts Off

    So I ran for 3 or so hours on Saturday without any issues. Went out in the afternoon and did some wakeboarding and cruising, came back in for dinner and went back out for a little sunset session with no issues. Went to go back out this afternoon and decided to top off the gas. I used a 5 gallon motorsports container that I had just filled up on Friday morning and added a bit of the stabil marine ethanol treatment and fuel stabilizer. Boat started right up and idled fine, ran for a few minutes at close to WOT and the engine bogged down and shut off (only after turning around and crossing my own wake). Waited a moment and started it back up with no issues. Decided to set up the tow rope and do some wakeboarding, got up on plane just fine, soon as I started crossing wake from the other boats it bogged down and shut off. Initially I thought it was the vent cap not allowing air in the fuel tank and causing the fuel system to dry up, but running with the cap off still had issues. Sometimes it will bog down and I can back off the throttle, it’ll idle rough for a few minutes then run fine. Ran slow back to the dock and let the boat idle for a bit, tried different rpm ranges in neutral with no issues at all. Decided to start rocking the boat and see if anything happened and it bogged down and shut off, but almost immediately fires back up. I have the VesselView mobile and I’m not getting any fault codes or issues, only seems to happen over mildly bumpy water and not when it’s smooth (mainly side to side rocking motion). Anyone have issues like this or any thoughts? I’m going to replace the fuel filter this week and try again.

    #2
    Any water in your fuel tank will be near the bottom where your fuel pickup will happily suck it up. Do you use a water separator?

    This may not be the issue but the bottom of the fuel tank is not quite flat and sloshing side to side may stir up any water in the bottom.

    Comment


      #3
      You provided some great detailed information.

      I agree this seems to be a fuel/water/contamination issue.

      Is that motorsports container used frequently or was this the first time in a long time?

      Plastic or metal?

      Does your element have a removable tank?

      It may kinda suck, but may be you need to go out and buy some more gas jugs and dump all the present fuel on those jugs for examination/isolation purposes.

      Maybe then "rinse" the tank with a quart of good fuel and dump it in the isolation gas jugs as well.

      If you have a squeeze bulb, (sorry I am an old timer) make sure all old gas is gone from it.

      Inspect/replace any filters.
      Present Boat- 2018 VR5 4.5/200hp Mercruiser
      Last Boat- 1998 Capri 1950CL 3.0 Mercruiser

      Comment


        #4
        Hi, hope you resolved your engine issue. You mention wakeboarding behind the 60 CT, I have the same boat & motor. Was wondering what prop your using, do you have a hydrofoil and are you able to pull adults. Glad to hear this boat can be used for watersports. All I've read on here is how the 75 is a must, I doubt there is a huge difference between the two due to the extra weight of the 75. I watched a video of the 75 topping out at 33 on GPS my boat does 30 on GPS. Thanks

        Comment


        • Shane74
          Shane74 commented
          Editing a comment
          I was able to test drive both the 60 and 75 before we made our purchase. The difference between the two was very noticeable both in top speed and plane time. With 5 adults the 60 would not get on plane and would not go over 10mph. The 75 has no issue with this. When we pull the tube around we never have to leave people at the dock.

        #5
        All good advise from above. Does it have fuel/water separator filter? If so that would be the first thing I look at. Carefully remove the filter and empty the contents onto a clear bottle. I like to use glass Snapple bottle. Let it sit a while if you have water it will sit on the bottom. I agree with those above and sound like water in your fuel.
        2016 Bayliner 215 Deck Boat
        Mercruiser 4.3 220 HP Alpha 1 Gen II

        2003 SeaRay 176 SRX Bowrider
        Mercruiser 3.0 135 HP Alpha 1 Gen II

        1988 Sunbird 170 Bowrider
        Evinrude 88 Special

        1970 Salem Skiff 13.5 foot
        1992 Johnson 40HP.

        Comment


          #6
          I’m not sure if the filter is a fuel water separator. It’s the owl style mounted to the motor that has that cartridge inside. I thought about the water issue, but I ran through half a tank the day before (it had been sitting on the trailer for 2-3 weeks) without issue. Issues started happening when I put brand new gas in it that I purchased on Saturday. There was about half a gallon of fuel in the container that was about 3 weeks old, stored in my shed in the meantime. Sealed cap and vent (think VP racing motorsports container). The other weirdness is that it has no issues in calm water, regardless of rpm.

          Comment


            #7
            Rocking the boat is what made me think of water in the filter. That would quickly mix with fuel and cause issues. No matter how clean you think the cans are you can't rule out water. How much water entered the boat when you hit your own wake?
            On another note have you check to make sure you don't have loose wire? Does that engine have an electric fuel pump?
            2016 Bayliner 215 Deck Boat
            Mercruiser 4.3 220 HP Alpha 1 Gen II

            2003 SeaRay 176 SRX Bowrider
            Mercruiser 3.0 135 HP Alpha 1 Gen II

            1988 Sunbird 170 Bowrider
            Evinrude 88 Special

            1970 Salem Skiff 13.5 foot
            1992 Johnson 40HP.

            Comment


              #8
              Had the same issue and found where the hose attached to the gas tank was not "fully" snapped into place...once I attached it, all was well. Check to make sure the connection to the gas tank is seated properly.
              2014 Flight Package 16' Element
              Upgrades: 90HP Merc, NFB Helm, Smart Tabs, 4 Blade 15P Prop, MercMonitor Gauge, Bimini Top, Custom Steering Wheel, Stainless Cup Holders, Radio w/4 speaker and Subwoofer + Amp

              Lacey, WA

              Comment


                #9
                Originally posted by Waterdowg View Post
                Rocking the boat is what made me think of water in the filter. That would quickly mix with fuel and cause issues. No matter how clean you think the cans are you can't rule out water. How much water entered the boat when you hit your own wake?
                On another note have you check to make sure you don't have loose wire? Does that engine have an electric fuel pump?
                How much water would it take for it to bog down or cut off? The onboard tank is completely full, I remember this happening one other time when I filled the tank completely, but it never happened again so I was unable to isolate the problem. Boat didn’t take on any water (and hasn’t), think small wake from passing boats, enough to rock the boat but not capsize or take on water.

                Comment


                • Waterdowg
                  Waterdowg commented
                  Editing a comment
                  It does not take much water to mix with fuel to bog or shutdown an engine. If you don't have a water fuel separator and water is sitting on the bottom of that bowl it can easily get mixed. Water can easily find its way in fuel, especially if you are using E85. There may have been water in the fuel from were you filled the can.
                  Your issue truly sounds fuel related either water or loose hose connection as stated. Keep us post as to what you checked.

                • vr5200
                  vr5200 commented
                  Editing a comment
                  I think Waterdowg meant to say E10, not E85.
                  In most areas of the country the fuel sold is E10. That is all our late model boats are built to tolerate.
                  If you stumble across a pump with E15,------- Do No Use It

                #10
                Originally posted by efarstad View Post
                Had the same issue and found where the hose attached to the gas tank was not "fully" snapped into place...once I attached it, all was well. Check to make sure the connection to the gas tank is seated properly.
                I’ll have to check that fitting. We were thinking about removing the fitting and dropping the hose straight in the gas tank to start isolating the problem, it’s not the easiest to get down inside and check the pickup or check the vacuum cap function. Another thought is the demand valve. From what I understand, the valve prevents the engine from flooding on a sealed system because the pressure cannot escape. I’m wondering if the tank has too much pressure or the demand valve is sticking and not opening

                Comment


                  #11
                  Originally posted by atrouth View Post

                  I’ll have to check that fitting. We were thinking about removing the fitting and dropping the hose straight in the gas tank to start isolating the problem, it’s not the easiest to get down inside and check the pickup or check the vacuum cap function. Another thought is the demand valve. From what I understand, the valve prevents the engine from flooding on a sealed system because the pressure cannot escape. I’m wondering if the tank has too much pressure or the demand valve is sticking and not opening
                  If the demand valve was sticking, rocking the boat wouldn't do anything. Check simple stuff first. Disconnect and reconnect to motor and to tank. The fuel systems are MADE to pressurize and remain sealed. That's why the tank swells when it gets really warm and stuff expands. Don't try to defeat the system. Right now, where you are, i'd have 2 suspicions. One is an incomplete connection from tank to motor and the other is still suspect gas. Rocking or bumps aren't going to affect many things. They'll make the gas slosh in the tank (and stir up whatever is in it. A loose fuel connector on the motor end I would think would be affected when you make turns. At the tank end the hose isn't really moving like on the motor end but if it's not seated properly then bumps could jostle it and it would suck air.

                  Simple first.

                  Comment


                    #12
                    What year motor, how many hours on motor, how many hours since last maintenance (and what was said last maintenance)?

                    What are your operating temps? Good solid telltale (pee) stream?

                    Comment


                      #13
                      Originally posted by 6104696 View Post
                      What year motor, how many hours on motor, how many hours since last maintenance (and what was said last maintenance)?

                      What are your operating temps? Good solid telltale (pee) stream?
                      Motor is a 2016, Im running the vesselview mobile module so I’m able to pull all of the info while it’s powered and running. Motor had 10 hours when I got the boat, just had the oil changed. I’ve put about 14 hours on it since I’ve had it (bought July 3rd of this year). An hour or two of that was fighting this issue and trying to diagnose or having to putter back to the dock. Stream is solid as usual, I can’t remember the operating temps off hand but I don’t think they were high? No codes thrown when the motor shuts off (vesselview would show them), rpm is irrelevant of when it bogs down/shuts off. I’ve had it happen and full throttle (or mostly full) partial throttle, idle, and neutral at various rpms when I manually rock the boat. Common cause seemed to be the boat rocking.

                      I keep things greased and check the oil, fuel filter, prop, intakes, etc. flush with fresh water after running. Boat is operated primarily in barely brackish water. I also run sta bil 360 marine fuel stabilizer and ethanol treatment in the 12 gallon Attwood tank. I know the last gas I put in was no more than 10% ethanol (according to the pump) and had been pumped 24 hours prior from a Wawa and not a dock pump. I did fill it almost to the brim, not sure if that would cause any issues or not.

                      I plan to check hoses, especially the quick disconnect on the tank itself, and install a new fuel filter. I seem to be able to reproduce the issue in neutral while at the dock, for safety reasons I’ll probably do that

                      Comment


                        #14
                        Originally posted by CparkerE16 View Post

                        If the demand valve was sticking, rocking the boat wouldn't do anything. Check simple stuff first. Disconnect and reconnect to motor and to tank. The fuel systems are MADE to pressurize and remain sealed. That's why the tank swells when it gets really warm and stuff expands. Don't try to defeat the system. Right now, where you are, i'd have 2 suspicions. One is an incomplete connection from tank to motor and the other is still suspect gas. Rocking or bumps aren't going to affect many things. They'll make the gas slosh in the tank (and stir up whatever is in it. A loose fuel connector on the motor end I would think would be affected when you make turns. At the tank end the hose isn't really moving like on the motor end but if it's not seated properly then bumps could jostle it and it would suck air.

                        Simple first.
                        I did notice that the bowl on the bowl on the fuel filter would go to what appeared to be empty while it was running (wouldn’t shut off, just looked empty). I’ll check all the connections I can see to make sure something isn’t sucking air or loose. Most of the connections are clamped and sealed, with the exception of the quick disconnect on the tank. I did use a light to look inside and there doesn’t appear to be debris in the tank, pickup looked clean as well, but I didn’t pull it all the way out. Turning the engine didn’t seem to cause the issue, but bumps (slow wake crossing that rocks the boat) definitely did.

                        Comment


                          #15
                          This is the filter currently installed on the motor. Other than the demand valve it looks to be a straightforward connection from the tank to the motor.

                          For those that have experience with this type of filter, is it sufficient or would it be beneficial to install a traditional in line fuel filter?

                          Comment

                          Working...
                          X