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TOPIC: WTB 4788 with Cummins in California (Cash Buyer)

WTB 4788 with Cummins in California (Cash Buyer) 01 May 2016 21:55 #1

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I been looking for a couple years off and on but now ready to buy. I have a $150k cash budget so I would like to buy from a owner most likely because I know there is not much out there listed with a Broker in that price range. I been looking mostly in SD and OC. I may be open to one in the PNW if the price reflects the cost to get it to San Diego. Frank

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WTB 4788 with Cummins in California (Cash Buyer) 02 May 2016 00:07 #2

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You may know this but Smitty has an excellent boat like you describe available. It in the north east, but look at the spec sheet in pics. Really nice.

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Tom Taylor
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Have served the same Admiral since 1978
Previous boat: 2002 3988 - Sabbatical

WTB 4788 with Cummins in California (Cash Buyer) 02 May 2016 08:03 #3

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Smitty's boat is sold.

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Jeff & Tara
(And Ginger too)
Lake Havasu City, AZ
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In memory of Shadow, the best boat dog ever. Rest in peace, girl. July 2, 2010

WTB 4788 with Cummins in California (Cash Buyer) 02 May 2016 17:16 #4

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I think you are a little under budgeted for a late model 4788. Early Hino powered 4788's *might* be in your budget, however plan on spending a bunch on upgrades.
Right now they are in high demand, and short supply. A 4558 might be within your budget.
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Boatless :-(
After all is said and done, there is always a lot more said than done.

WTB 4788 with Cummins in California (Cash Buyer) 02 May 2016 20:04 #5

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I been looking at a few 4788 in my area for about two year's now and the prices where over $220k when they first listed them and now around $180k and sthey still have not sold. I looked at two this weekend and they where $170k. I would like to find a private owner because even the one's listed at $170k would be around $150k to the owner once sold. I was going to go with the 4588's but the soft decks issue outway the lower prices. I also had a almost donen deal on a one owner for $62k that was listed for $125k for two years and was the cleanest out of any 4588 I saw in person but owner sold it for $68k........I wanted to do complete interior make over and full exterior gel repair and buff and inenglass and servicing of eniges and had estimates for about $45k. Like I said this was the cleanest one I saw in two years and the deck was the least visual in need of repair. The guy that bought it did $25k in upgrades and now is into it for over $30k in deck repairs. When done it will be nice but still 12 years older than what I am looking now. So now I am stuck on just a 4788.

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WTB 4788 with Cummins in California (Cash Buyer) 02 May 2016 20:44 #6

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DaBank

I really think you're a tad under market for a Good example of a West Coast, Cummins powered 4788.

Boats at the bottom of the market are generally the ones that need allot of work, and when you add that work up you'll often find that you're into the boat more than if you bought a better maintained example.

In my opinion the best value you'll find in a boat is buying one that the owner has meticulously maintained, for the best price you can negotiate.

But... That said, best of luck in your search
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KEVIN SANDERS
4788 LISAS WAY
SEWARD, ALASKA
www.mvlisasway.com

WTB 4788 with Cummins in California (Cash Buyer) 02 May 2016 21:06 #7

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"I really think you're a tad under market for a Good example of a West Coast, Cummins powered 4788.
Boats at the bottom of the market are generally the ones that need allot of work, and when you add that work up you'll often find that you're into the boat more than if you bought a better maintained example.
In my opinion the best value you'll find in a boat is buying one that the owner has meticulously maintained, for the best price you can negotiate.
But... That said, best of luck in your search"

Plus 100 Kevin,

Same thing really on the east coast here - there are some bargain prices on 47's but no bargain boats> You would be amazed at what is wrong with some of these 'examples' being marketed at lower prices, And for the most part the problems which are big ones are being hidden and camouflaged so often potential buyers are into survey dollars before they are aware if ever.
The real cost of any boat is the acquisition cost plus the cost to get it cleaned up and kept running eh first few years after neglect.
The internet has people chasing lowest prices with no good way to evaluate the condition on relative boats that are out there or that have sold already - some of the hi-res pictures of these lower priced boats would really scare you.

Here are the minimum questions I would ask before I even traveled to any boat to view it - hope they help.

I actually have an initial set of boat questions for when I call a boat for sale myself. YMMV but these have worked well for me to sift out the ones I was more interested in pursuing...

- Are all those pictures of your boat?
- Are the machinery hours TT?
- Do you have a full list of all items and options that convey with the boat?
- Are there maintenance records and are they up to date?
- Do you have a full history of the boat? Has it been damaged, partially submerged or seen heavy repairs?
- Can you send me 40-50 hi-res photos of the boat including all of the machinery?
- What is your cruise and max speeds and at what rpm do you see those?
- What currently does not work on the boat?
- Where is the boat currently and in what condition is it stored?
- Do you own this boat or maybe is it under an LLC or partnership? Do you have 100% rights to sell the boat unencumbered?
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Northport NY

WTB 4788 with Cummins in California (Cash Buyer) 03 May 2016 09:04 #8

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Hi Frank,

I got a chuckle about buying directly from owner to save money? I bought my 4788 last year directly from the owner because he would not hire a broker and he wanted the broker fee. It was painful, but the boat was in great shape and located in a slip that I could assume. It took an extrodinary long time as the owner had deep pockets and no financial need to sell. So don't assume broker fees will be passed to the buyer.

Good luck in your search.

Cheers,

Bob
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2001 Bayliner 4788, Cummins 370's
Zodiac Yachtline 380, Yamaha 25hp
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WTB 4788 with Cummins in California (Cash Buyer) 03 May 2016 09:26 #9

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Others have said it on this site, you are not just buying a used boat but you are also buy the previous owner.

I take it from your post that you are hoping that cash talks and bs walks. But in my experience it makes no difference if a buyer has cash or a loan....I get cash either way.

If a seller was impressed with cash.....it would make me suspicious of what has not been maintained or has been deferred for the next owner. Eventually I was rewarded by finding an owner with deep pockets. He was not impressed with my initial low ball offers because he had consistently spent whatever it took to maintain his vessel in top shape. He knew he had a special boat.

I am only in my second season but 80 engine hours later and having been invited on several other 4788's, he was right.
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2001 Bayliner 4788, Cummins 370's
Zodiac Yachtline 380, Yamaha 25hp
Sanger wakeboard boat
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WTB 4788 with Cummins in California (Cash Buyer) 03 May 2016 14:21 #10

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Oakland4788 wrote: Others have said it on this site, you are not just buying a used boat but you are also buy the previous owner.

I take it from your post that you are hoping that cash talks and bs walks. But in my experience it makes no difference if a buyer has cash or a loan....I get cash either way.

If a seller was impressed with cash.....it would make me suspicious of what has not been maintained or has been deferred for the next owner. Eventually I was rewarded by finding an owner with deep pockets. He was not impressed with my initial low ball offers because he had consistently spent whatever it took to maintain his vessel in top shape. He knew he had a special boat.

I am only in my second season but 80 engine hours later and having been invited on several other 4788's, he was right.


So many people think that all examples of a given year/make/model are close to each other in "value", when just the opposite is true.

Fixing up a big boat is not the same as fixing up a smaller boat. For example on a 28' boat you could be happy with a $1200 GPS/chart plotter. On a large boat that same unit would look out of place. But the cost for that multi display electronics package with open array radar is very close to $20,000.

On a small boat you can put in a heating system in a weekend for $2,000. On a 4788 you'll spend well north of $10,000 for heat and probably more like $15,000.

Remember that little 8' Zodiac you had on your 28' boat? Oh no! On your 4788 you'll easily drop $10-20,000 on a new skiff.

The list goes on and on. Bargain boats are seldom a bargain. This is a lesson new large boat owners learn over and over again. :sick:
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KEVIN SANDERS
4788 LISAS WAY
SEWARD, ALASKA
www.mvlisasway.com

WTB 4788 with Cummins in California (Cash Buyer) 03 May 2016 14:45 #11

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Oakland4788 wrote: ... So don't assume broker fees will be passed to the buyer.


I used to buy and sell airplanes for a living and found this to be true in most cases. Airplanes traded at market value, regardless of whether they were sold through a broker or directly by an owner. I imagine boats are the same.
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WTB 4788 with Cummins in California (Cash Buyer) 03 May 2016 16:35 #12

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"The list goes on and on. Bargain boats are seldom a bargain"

Yes - I agree completely. I often say that a great deal is never a cheap deal and a cheap deal is almost never a great deal when it comes to boats and sports cars.
If you shop for say Corvettes and begin with a year and price and not be concerned with condition you will certainly find one. But of you consider condition and options and search around those parameters you can then build a price range that supports that goal.

FWIW - Right now I am aware of at least two 47's on the East coast that will likely sell in the area of $110K - $120K. And I am familiar with another two that will likely sell between $120 and 130K.
Even though I have been known to be quite capable of refitting , repairing and renovating things like boats I do not consider any of them to be good deals , not even decent deals.
Because even if you work your butt off for free on these boats the costs for parts and such will put you back near the top of a well maintained boat and you will still have cosmetics left to attend to.

The message is know if you are looking to go boating or if you are looking to take on a multi-year project - be an educated buyer, know your limits.

Good luck and hope this helps
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Northport NY

WTB 4788 with Cummins in California (Cash Buyer) 03 May 2016 18:57 #13

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Just chiming in, agreeing with the others. Here in the PNW you'll find the 4788s with Cummins are listing between $200K to $250K. Average sales prices are between $185K to $225K. I think a $150K purchase price will require at least $30K in repairs and deferred maintenance, probably more like $50K. If you have to replace/upgrade old isinglass and electronics, the cost goes up. Adding diesel heat to my boat cost $12K. If I add a bowthruster, $10-12K. And so on.

I have found that if the seller has a broker and you work directly with the broker, the lure of getting both ends of the commission puts the broker on your side in terms of closing the deal. The broker won't care if you buy a lemon, but he will happily help you buy it!

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Rob Meldrum
Commodore, Edmonds Yacht Club (2014-2015)
"Miss Maui" * 1997 Bayliner 4788 * Cummins 330s

WTB 4788 with Cummins in California (Cash Buyer) 04 May 2016 03:25 #14

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Thank you all for your advice. I come from a offshore race boat background and still have a nice 32' Skaker with twin 1150hp motors. With that said I know the vaule of a open checkbook owner verses a owner that waits for a failure. Cash is king.......sometimes yes if you are in the right place at the right time. Do I want to find the best deal that is in my favor......yes and no. I been leasing 45's and 47's off and on for five years from two friends, so I seen and heard first hand what to look for on these model's. I want a clean boat that has not been remade and remodel a bunch of times with hidden issues. I will have the boat inspected by two professional in there fleids and I will also go over everything I have seen first hand on these boats and what I have read up on. Prices do vary in location...... Florida these are cheap, PNW they ask higher dollar but also have upgrades based on weather. California prices are all over the place depending on what cosmically was JUST done......some people spend $20k on new soft goods might not be everyone's else taste. Some times by owner sale for more than from a Broker and I know that market bears the final price but just like homes,planes,boat and trains both sides maybe are willing to deal and owner may even end up with more than they would have recived from a broker. With all this said if anyone sees a nice 4788 with in my price range in California please keep me posted. Again thank you guys for all your help and only.

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WTB 4788 with Cummins in California (Cash Buyer) 06 May 2016 15:27 #15

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I am in San Diego till Monday. If anyone has a 4788 for sale or know of one not listed please let me know, we are going to go look at two of them.

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WTB 4788 with Cummins in California (Cash Buyer) 08 May 2016 18:44 #16

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I think you need to come up with some more money. In the SF Bay area a 4788 with cummings will fetch $160-200k, depending on how good of shape it's in. Even a clean one with Hinos run $150-175k I got lucky, bought mine from a couple we had known, they had health issues. The boat is super clean, we gave $170k and it's worth every penny. Good luck on your hunt- looking is half the fun!

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Craig & Vicki
and Sally Sue & Lucy Lou
1994 4788 "Treading Water" Dink- "Skid Marks"
Homeport: Pittsburg Ca
San Francisco Bay/Delta
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